If we go by that logic, 40 man raids and having to raid for epics is casual.
Your dodging the question and not comprehending what I am proposing.
When you wiped on raids in eq. You lost levels. Then you had to go grind them back before you could give it another go. You also dropped all your gear ⊠which would disappear you didnât grab it back.
I used to run people to their corpses in pof all day.
There was also no minimap. Just x/y cords with /loc
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Are they also going to squish M+ rewards back down? Or will you still be able to infinitely farm better than heroic raid gear from keys? Will the mythic raids be tuned around you doing this?
There are literally posts above where people want outdoor solo content to be considered another pillar of endgame progression on the same level as Raiding/M+ and PvP.
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Itâs ok for not every game to be the same.
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I mean, probably anything that isnât âGo here, kill X thing for 1 minute, repeat 4 times per zone until finished.â
Iâve said time and again that I think Torghast (even though itâs not in the open world, I think think this falls under the umbrella of content we often refer to as being outside of raids and M+) was an excellent opportunity for Blizzard to create something that was replayable and engaged the entire playerbase in meaningful ways. Torghastâs implementation, however, was horrid. Roguelikes thrive on replayability. They thrive on being able to exploit the systems and being able the actually break the game. Itâs a genre that rewards you with thinking outside of the parameters of the gameâs surface mechanics.
Nothing good about the genre was present in Torghast. Replayability was nonexistent because the game punished you for replaying it by decreasing the rewards you got. Part of the reward scheme with roguelikes is that you get unlocks that are then dumped into the resource pile that the game pulls from when generating a new floor. This could either be a new ability, a new enemy type, a new secret to find, a new boss that drops new items, or a new level aesthetic in general. There was nothing like that in Torghast. After the first few runs, the replayability factor was virtually non-existent. Above all of this, but Torghast was so microtuned that breaking it or exploiting it was near impossible. Coupled with the fact that Torghast featured a weekly lockout where you couldnât run any other area besides the two available for that week, and you have a game that fails to be a roguelike in every measure. The only thing it has in common is that itâs randomly generated.
Something like Torghast should be revisited in the future without all the nonsense Blizzard seems to want to attach to just about every cool and potentially significant feature they have in their expansions.
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Iâm pointing out that incentives / gear matters to everyone. Take away the incentive, and there is no reason to do it.
The primary means of advancement / incentive in wow is gear. Period.
Mythic raiders would all quit if the loot was only cosmetic, and itâs no different for world content players.
The big problem is that you will feel less cool about your accomplishment if someone else can get it with less effort. If it was FUN ⊠why would it matter?
Itâs not fun ⊠getting the gear isnât fun. HAVING the gear is fun.
Aka itâs not the raid lots of people enjoy, itâs the getting and using the gear. means to an end
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Well, if you equalized gear that goes away for everyone.
Itâs always funny when you get these âI donât see these postsâ people reply right under said posts they pretend to not be seeing.
Itâs almost like theyâre completely bad faith actors.
Lots of Mythic raiders raid by extending a lock out, completely locking them out of loot.
People push keys above 15.
You canât say things like âthey would all quitâ, because we know thatâs patently false.
Of course, since you hide on an alt, we have no way to confirm your experience level with said content, so we can probably deduce you have none.
You probably have to explain what a lock out is.
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There is nothing wrong with that in theory.
To me that just means they want it to be treated by blizzard as a valid end game that they put effort into.
It doesnt have to mean that rewards scale to mythic level.
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Itâs been 18 years. It will never be a pillar of end game.
If they want that, they should go play something that has the world as a pillar of end game.
They are already treated fairly for the effort they put into it. Effort in open-world content is not justifying higher than LFR loot.
Extending a lockout and having zero gear rewards for the mode are completely different.
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Right, but it still shows that people still choose to do mythic without getting loot
Just the fact Cutting Edge exists is a reward. Most Mythic raiders donât put in all the effort of weeks of lock out extensions for the loot which barely exists once youâre in extension season.
No, they are getting loot. They are just choosing to forgo loot temporarily for further progress.
Not even close to the same thing.
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So youâre saying they are consciously deciding that the loot is worth less than the achievement.
Kinda defeating your own point there.
From M+. Once you beat Halondrus, the entire raid gets a total of 16 items from M raid until jailer dies, assuming you do the standard Mythic prog and extend on anduin.