How to Win AV - As Alliance

WoW Classic WoW Classic General Discussion
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So here is the 1.12 Strategy that Alliance was using back then to Win AV.

First of all, in case you ask:

i. yes it does involve Fighting the Horde in the process. Yet remember, this is how Alliance had 55% win rates in Vanilla or more in some cases.

ii. yes I am aware of AFKers/Bots etc today. Yet Nothing we can do until Blizzard Developers address it.

iii. yes I am posting the Strategy Publicly and horde will see it too. Yet it is not as if it is a secret. Any serious PvPer knows it from Vanilla, the Horde is just playing against it right now and it is why they Win. And alliance is falling for it.

iv. Of course many will try to deny this plan works. But this is not Theory it worked in practice in Vanilla. Just try it!

Here it goes :slight_smile: (from memory)

1- Game starts at the Cave, everyone Buffs and quickly announces the plan and people take their roles.

2- 10 Alliance people head to defend SH gy, with healers and all. Watch that Flag pole do not let anyone Cap it.

3- The Rest (30 people) heads directly to Snowfall GY.

There a couple of things can happen:

A- The horde is waiting for you. At which point it is an uphill battle. Enjoy it Push, respawn at SH and go SF till it is taken.

B- The horde is going for Belinda and SH. SF is open. Some people need to stay and defend it till it caps (usually a party of 5).

C- The horde and Alliance meet just before Snowfall and a Fight ensure. Dismount and fight kill the Horde, remount and push to Snowfall.

4- Once Snowfall is Taken, the remaining force of now 25 Goes to Galv and Iceblood Tower. 20 kill Galv and 5 Contest Iceblood Tower, and remain in the tower untill it caps.

5- Once Glav is Dead, the 20 remaining head to Iceblood Graveyard, 15 remain to Defend it as it caps 5 Contest Tower Point.

6- In the mean time, by now, the 10 original Defenders are in Thick battle at SH and it is most probably taken. So defense is push to SP gy, and are now Fighting there in the curve the incoming horde.

7- Iceblood Tower IB Gy and Tower point Cap. 5 remain to Protect IB GY while the rest advance to Frostwolf GY.

8- Secure Frostwold GY, take (take coldtooth mine etc) and onward to Contest Frostwold Keep.

Several things may happen in mean time and after this time, you have to be able to communicate and inform each-other in chat so that Alliance can react to Horde decisions and counter them as needed.

A- Horde reacts to the plan and retreats to retake IB and FW GY or Recalls to the Keep.

These are all things to be expected. Then Alliance retakes SH etc and 5 remain as a Defense in SH area, eliminating stray Horde Trying to Cap gy behind the lines etc, while all the rest push south to the Keep.

B- Horde Pushes on to take SP, the defenders now should be communicating with the Offense, some people from Offense could reinforce Defense 5 usually so now you have 15 defenders that should be defending on the Bridge. Traps CC et all…assisted by Tower NPC’s. The bridge is key. Sometimes you may even want to do 20-20, or even 25-15 (provided 15 can take on Drek), and depending on the Horde Decisions.

So this was how Alliance Won in Vanilla.

Right now Alliance does none of this. Alliance goes for SH bunker losing precious time till that Caps, then push to SH till that is taken Pushed to SP gy till that is taken. Separated in two between the Cave where respawns do not even try to take back SP gy back while it caps and is protected by 3 Horde and the NPCs and roam south aimlessly (sometimes Horde even lets em knowing that they have no time to do anything hurting). SP gy caps, Horde contests SP aid Station eliminates Alliance in there and Starts on Vandar…3 minutes later Van is dead, and Game over.

As you can see the current Horde Plan hinges on Alliance not Going for SF and Galv and instead Going for the SH bunker. And it works very well :slight_smile:

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You know this doesn’t work because all 40 horde are looking to take SH ASAP and farm kills for 15 minutes before even thinking of pushing up. Alliance pugs that ruin AV never check these forums and with the new hot fix in AV horde are going back to 100% honor vs 0% honor for alliance. AV is dead and anyone not in a high rank WSG group is screwed.

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Basically this ^ Alliance only do AV for rep.

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The problem is alliance dont just want to win, they want to win fast. That requires playing no defense… but no defense in pug vs. pug = loss every time.

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Noted, noted, noted. Thanks.

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Well, it is not 15 minutes. it is 10 minutes to Kill Belinda and delay alliance at SH then 5 minutes to Cap SH and towers and then push forward.

Horde has a a similar plan only for their side and tit is being followed :wink:

I just post here to remind all, whether anyone from alliance reads or not it is here now. And the word can be passed to people in game. You only need a few to remember how to play AV again :slight_smile:

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Won’t work, horde can turtle effortlessly and sent 15 on offense due to where their cave is located.

They also have a much faster path to cap bunkers, which matters if they don’t resist your 25 man push.

The only way to win consistently is to kill all the horde and hold them at the triangle. You can’t let any north. Because they can split turtle so easily, you have to defend as you attack. Horde don’t have to do this. Hence the advantage.

SFGY is only useful if they’re pushing to take SHGY, and that only happens if you allow them north.

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It worked in Vanilla for the three months of 1.12

This is not Theory, this is how it was in practice.

You have to fight in Mid by Belinda and Sh and SF. That is where the two forces meet.

Dismount fight and remount.

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If you get SHGY, there is literally no way for the alliance team to push past the IWB choke. Considering you can get to SHGY about the same time that alliance can means one wipe and no one gets let by. After that if you do get by you have hunters and druids tracking humanoids because god forbid one LT gets killed and makes it someone reasonable to be in AV.

With premades it was still very much even when it came to win rates and honor was extremely balanced. Taking away premades not only puts Horde win rate in the high 90s, but also has an honor average around 5000 to 600 horde to alliance.

Having a character on both Horde and Alliance I see no problem with alliance premades as most time Horde still wins and gets honor. I’ve only seen one 0 bonus honor match as a horde where without premades it happens every other AV for alliance. The honor farmers will go back to WSG and the pugs will all quit AV. Blizzard has completely destroyed the BG experience for alliance pugs. Anyone that says otherwise is blinded by their own lust for blood and honor.

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Did you think people would be reasonable after seeing phase 2?

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You cannot win, horde are at Balinda before Alliance can get to her. SH Bunker is right inside Horde area and is only defendable with good players or skilled back capping.

Alliance are just going to get farmed at SH, pushed back and fight a losing battle while Horde terrain exploit into base, cap North/South bunkers and Alliance unable to stop the push.

The reasons premades worked because we treated it like any raid or organized attack. Protect healers, follow a leader and take objectives and switch if one strat wasn’t working.

Alliance pugs cannot do that. Blizzard is super concerned about stopping premades yet doesn’t fix the insane amount of issues with the BG itself.

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If you are a horde player only, reroll alliance just for the opportunity to see first how bad the pugs are. Try to get them to organize as everyone keeps says. It just doesn’t happen and you end up getting reported for spamming. They only want rep and get mad when they get attacked. I don’t know how many times you hear someone say they are farming rams for the skins when alliance can’t do anything with them…

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Just stop playing AV.

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pretty much this

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Yep, pretty much this.

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You did not read the Strategy, it shows.

Where in this Strategy did it say that you have to Defend Belinda or SH Bunker?

Belinda is optional, but only works as a delay tactic. She will fall. SH bunker is a necessary Sacrifice for the Alliance. Do not even bother.

Alliance thrust should not be going that way anyways.

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Uhhh… Dude I premade a lot of games. I have a good understanding of AV.

I never said to defend Balinda, just that horde are at Balina before Alliance are. Because of the cave being so close, Horde can literally be at our own Captain before Alliance can. This is a huge advantage.

The reason SH bunker is brought up is because Horde has no tower sticking out in Alliance territory, meaning Horde can start capping stuff way before Alliance can. These are direct advantages.

If Alliance cannot get IBGY then it’s over. That’s it. Alliance has no choke point equal to IBGY/IBT. There’s zero winning as an Alliance pug even if you try if you don’t have everyone playing their top game.

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Not in 1.12 AV which when become relevant to do in TBC alliance simple boycoted.

Good you are aware you are outnumbered.

1.12 stayed 30 days in vanilla and more than one year in TBC

There aren’t 10 alliance to beign with.
And you need 2 healers.
And this was to farm rep.

I loled.
When allaince gets 30 horde is already close to cave camping.

They are cave camping.

They are cave camping

Cave camping still.

You would need 40 people to do that unfortunaly the offense just became a thing when horde got Icewing at the best possible moment.

Btw by when you cap snowfall hrode will bet at stormpike.

It didnt.
Nobody actually cared about anything in pre tbc patch… win or losing was an accident.

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Well, I do not get it, we agree on ibgy, but this is why this strategy worked in Vanilla, it focuses on ibgy early and fast in the game.

it matters no if horde is at Belinda, you just pass through go SF, Galv Tower sand ib GY as planned while holding SH gy.

if you want to delay horde in Belinda you can even assign a party of 5 to defend her for a while, mess things up as you are passing by.

Right now Alliance goes to SH Bunker instead of SF, Galv, IB gy…this is a mistake.

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I’ve literally have not played an AV where Alliance go defend SH bunker and not go right. In fact Horde are already by SF attacking the end tail of our premade, we’re talking people with epic mounts. Usually we cap SF, ride to IBGY.

I’ve only been in a handful where the group defends SH after the first initial horde push and even then half the horde is by balinda or camping out in the field.

The best game I’ve had is with a 5 man team of 3 rogues/2 druid that back capped everything.

1 Like