I don’t think I agree. When Divine Toll sends out Judgments, yea, that feels really similar to Blessed Champion. But if DT instead sent out five BoVs, that would be an AoE ability firing off multiple times, similar to how DT works with Avenger’s Shield for Prot.
My only beef with Divine Resonance is that it makes the Judgment debuff too prevalent. I find the passive holy power gen fun to manage.
DT (specifically Divine Resonance) is important in ST for Ret. It allows more finishers to be spammed when bursting and almost guarantees a Radiant Glory proc to extend the initial Radiant Glory from having used WoA.
I think that Churchmouse’s proposal would be really interesting for that Ashen Hallow type ability, it would certainly be much more interesting than the Judgement version of DT if it gained all the effects of BoJ, like Expurgation and Consecrated Blade.
Casting 5 BoJ and seeing 5 unique Consecrations drop certainly would be epic, I just feel like it would then become too similar to Blade of Vengeance, Final Reckoning, and Searing Light for my taste.
Because of those talents, I’d rather see Churchmouses’ ability be a replacement for FR and/or Searing Light… =/
That’s why I’m more interested in the utility options;
Avatar
Bladestorm vs Ravager
Champion Spear
These all feel unique.
Avenging Wrath
Execution Sentence vs Final Reckoning (Maybe FR replaced with Churchmouse’s mass BoJ?)
______ ??_______
Edit:
Personally I think there’s a bit too much “big ability padding” with Ret right now.
Avenging Wrath / Crusade
Wake of Ashes
Divine Toll
Final Reckoning / Execution Sentence
Divine Arbiter
Searing Light
Hammer of Light
Light’s Deliverance
Would it be better to condense Divine Toll, Final Reckoning, Execution Sentence, Divine Arbiter and Searing Light into 2-3 powerful fun cooldowns?
Interesting point, but I feel that’s more an issue with Final Reckoning and Searing Light. Personally I’d like to see FR drop a single gigantic hammer, I’m talking really silly proportions. Make it one of the bottom-left capstones to really sell the holystrike theme.
But Divine Toll is a class talent and so I think the best way to fix it for Ret is to change which ability it triggers. It’s already awesome for Prot, we just need a simple way to achieve that for Ret.
I wouldn’t mind losing Divine Arbiter and Searing Light as they aren’t super interesting (or big DPS for that matter). Ret’s final gate is definitely missing something.
The unique class perk used to be the Aura’s and Seals. Just bring them back. I noticed they are playing around with weird off healing stuff? Screw that, just give them their cool stuff back. I miss Aura of Kings.
Nah, hate transformation cooldowns. If I wanted to shapeshift I would play a druid and never look at my character or mogs again.
Sure, if you are playing Prot. I feel like ret barely makes use of it. It’s not like I hate it, it’s basically free extra things. But it feels shoe horned in, like they are looking for something to give paladins when they literally already have a fan favorite thing they refuse to use.
I love the new class tree with things like Worthy Sacrifice, Seal of the Crusader and Lightbearer. I can actually see the difference in the self-sustain heals. It’s what made me give up my favorite spell, Templar Strikes for csaa.
Again, I wouldn’t mind bringing back the auras, for sure, but I’m enjoying the “weird off healing.”
It’s clear from your statement that you don’t understand RET this spec
Everything affected by “burning-crusade” and “burning-to-ash” is considered DOT, Including things you wouldn’t consider DOT.
They’re all DOTs.
These damn DOTs replace the importance of FV/HOW in the RET damage pool(30% or even more than 40%)
So your FV is only a pathetic 300k instead of the 1M damage it should be doing
and Why is DF S2:
All I’m telling you is that RET got reinvented in late DF S1 (10.07)
Compared to 10.07’s IMBA, in DF S2, the tweaked RET is very healthy
And it has a very good damage percentage (FV/HOW/etc) FV is really big damage and HOW is AOE damage with 4-set effect
It’s an excellent design for Discipline Rider, both in terms of damage structure and career fantasy
RET is a big, fierce hammer, not a flimsy thing like MELEE AFF that relies on DOTs
DF S3 S4 — all right no bad, but DOT gradually started replacing it compared , until TWW - RET was a thoroughly hilarious DOT clown
They added some DoT in TWW but only 2 have any significance, of which you can only have 1 active at any given time because EH are Templar exclusive and Dawnlight is herald exclusive.
The rest is either not played (templar strike) or irrelevant in terms of damage (Sun sear).
They outright said the Hero spec would amount for 20-30% of our output.
That’s what they do.
So pray tell, what dot are you talking about?
We have Truth wake (Present in DF S2), Expurg (Present in DF S2) and either EH or Dawnlight which were added in TWW.
What other DoT were added that are so “strong” that they reduce the spender damage?
Ret plays the same it did before.
Here we go.
You didn’t like any specific design difference from S2 DF, how could you? There isn’t much difference between the 2.
You liked the specific tuning of S2 lol
You liked an happenstance…
No one knows what that is but you.
What the hell do you think Hammer of Light is?
Are you trolling?
Tell us when in S3 and S4 of DF they added more “dots” to Ret.
We’ll wait a long time because they didn’t.
You’re fabulating…
Look…
Ret rework didn’t scale well with stats, it had (and somewhat still has) some talents that capped stats like HoW 100% crit which rendered crit rating useless for HoW or talents that flat out didn’t scale with a stat in particular.
For example
Wake itself doesn’t scale with haste
FR doesn’t DIRECTLY scale with haste
Searing light doesn’t scale with haste (a Proc with an ICD of 15 sec -_-)
Divine Arbiter can’t crit.
In TWW HoW was fixed, it does less damage than it used to in general but will do more in execute phase and will scale better, WHICH IS A GOOD THING.
To return it to somewhat of a reasonable direction, the return of exorcism. Wonderfully thematic spell for ret. Why dont they just add a talent that (this is just feely stuff so dont get butthurt) when judgement crits, it has a x% chance to turn judgment to exorcism. Exorcism does spell dmg, its insta, guar crit, has a 20 yrd range, and has wonderful graphics. Add a node on the tree where exorcism will hit multiple targets. Generates 2 holy power.
I think it would be a great way to add an old spell into modern times without adding bloat. It makes thematic sense because first you judge then you exorcist. Lastly, it gives pallys a lil extra umph outside their spenders.
I do too. I’ve played since Vanilla and I think this is one of the best overall designs Ret has had.
I just think some things could be better.
It’s a neat idea but similar to our mastery: Judgment has a chance to hit a second time based on a secondary stat, and when it does it plays the Exorcism sound effect.
Personally, I think it’s the opposite. Too much of Ret’s DPS comes from Empyrean Hammers and Dawnlights and neither are emphasized very well in the toolkit.
They don’t feel like attacks you are manually pressing or DoTs you are casting, they just work passively in the background and that’s usually not a great feeling.
A spec historically known for its burst, is now doing 30-40% of their dps through DoTs, and those DoTs don’t get applied in a very purposeful mannor. =/
It don’t hit a 2nd time, but it does do additional damage, and gives a stack of DA/chance proc searing. Mastery is seperate from a judgement, and does not grant greater judgement, it procs off judgement and HoW (if talented).
You misread my suggestion. The proc would not be a dot, it would be an actual spell to press that would replace judgment. Judgment would essentially transform into exorcism. Not only would this be better than just a random second judgment, but it provides a much more meaningful builder, a thematic choice, and creates depth.
I understand, I meant, I don’t think Paladins need any other “uuphm” outside of our Spenders currently. Our spenders feel too weak and any extra source of damage outside of buffing them right now would be misplaced.
Also, I think Holy Blade (Blade of Justice generates 1 additional Holy Power) is just the “lazy man’s” version of Exorcism, lol.
Divine Storm had its radius reduced to I believe 6 yds. Notice the text was changed, and you can test it yourself using JV as a yardstick. It should go back to 8 yds, while Tempest of the Lightbringer should project the entire ability forward 12 yds (down from 20).
My second suggestion regards Dawnlight. First, one Divine Storm should spread both charges generated by Wake of Ashes. Second, Dawnlight applied either in this fashion or by Wings should prioritize targets that do not currently have Dawnlight applied to them. This would make Herald less frustrating in AoE when Dawnlights randomly all get applied to the same target.
Mastery is a separate damage event, that’s all I was saying, and it’s not relevant to the point I was making.
You mean updates to the current hero trees, or do you think they’ll add additional trees?
