Saurfang apparently
Try again.
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Well just saying if a old orc can beat him i am sure a young orc can do better, zappy boi can probably beat him, and theres thrall, apparently orcs are so powerful thrall can probably beat him without his shaman powers
The most powerful orc Warrior in the Hordeā¦ after getting a sneak attack from behind after malf fought Sylvanas.
Literal meme character.
Who canāt use his Shaman powers.
Try again.
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Well, as an ex-Horde player, donāt bother.
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Blizzard will ignore the issue until they care about it and then, āpoofā, the side they want will be unstoppable.
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The only reason sees to care about Horde power is to make them more effective villains for the Alliance.
How is it a issue if it doesnt matter lol, like I said, its only a issue if you want to lord over other players about it
Literally my dad can beat your dad level of silliness
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What now malfurion should have eyes in the back of his head? lol
You canāt claim Saurfang is a counter to Malf.
You have 0 argument.
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I mean you did I am just trying to see it from your logic
Claim Saurfang as a counter to Malf? No. You even confirmed this with your statement that Saurfang didnāt 1v1 Malf.
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I think one issue is that the writers arenāt good at showcasing the powerful Horde characters that exist, and also donāt lean into the sheer physical superiority the Horde races have over the Alliance ones.
Jaina in Stormwind chasing the Horde is a good example. I donāt think the implication was that she could beat them all, it never was. The implication was that if they fought her, it would take too long to beat her and by then all of the Alliance forces in Stormwind would be on top of them. Sheās Thalyssraās counterpart in Nazjatar, and itās shown in the chain that it takes them both to do some things, working together, which suggests a level of parity in terms of power.
It comes down to Blizzardās annoying habit of focusing heavily on a small group of characters in an expansion, even as their narrative tools continue to get better and allow them to do more Rule of Cool things.
Back in WoD, people were saying that Khadgar was more powerful than Jaina, because he was doing all these ridiculous things with seemingly little effort, and was benefiting from the cutscenes and new storytelling tools that Blizzard brought to bear in that expansion. This was when Jaina had everything she has now, all the same relics and power ups, but because people saw Khadgar do more, they assumed he was stronger. If we still had the old forums, going back far enough would show these threads.
So as usual, it comes down less to a power parity issue, and more to a āBlizzard is bad at writingā issue. On paper, it should take a team of human soldiers to take down a single tauren. On paper, trolls should be able to fight continuously through terrible injuries due to regeneration, and overwhelm their opponents. On paper, Forsaken probably wouldnāt stop fighting until a monumental amount of physical trauma was done to them. And itās the same issue with the Horde heroes. Thalyssra at her absolute weakest was able to stop time, kill other mages while outnumbered, and make a shield that stood up to dozens of Withered throwing themselves at it. Iād say sheās a major powerhouse, but as usual Blizzard pushes the story through, without letting the characters drive.
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Letās not forget the time Anduin had a gigantic bell dropped on him that despite breaking all his bones didnāt kill him but gave him spider senses.
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This might be a small nitpick but there actually is a moment at the end of the scenario where she stops the entire horde breakout party. Itās why Zul set that wildfire in Stormwind; he forced her to choose between saving lives or keeping the whole group locked down. She actually did stop them but had to relent due to Zulās foresight manipulating her values.
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This is a flat out lie, level 117 night elf warrior.
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I guess Iād feel bad if my faction was written as being in the right all the timeā¦ 
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And whatās the point in having all these power houses? We canāt do anything with them.
Itās so awesome to read books where Tyrande always at least once per book goes to solo armies. Malfurion going up against the top of the top like Azshara or the Nightmare. When he enveloped the whole world in Storm. Or when we alone created a vortex strong enough to hold Darkshore in one piece during the Cataclysm.
But then comes the Horde and our S tier powerhouses just stumble over a rock and delete themselves from the equation. Thereās always something that wonāt ever let them do the only thing they are portrayed as.
How do you guys think it feels for us to know for fact all those two can do and still lose expansion after expansion pieces of our land to some Orcs that several years ago landed on our coasts on a boat? Iām a to believe that those few Orcs that came and then the few that survived Hyjal and the Legion invasion were completly rolfstomping our armies and there was nothing we could do?
Having all these Powerful characters accomplishes nothing so we might as well just removed them completly and nothing would really change so I canāt understand why so much complaining about our characters when they have never been able to act in any believable way.
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Yeah, weāve established this.
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Yāall want receipts? Okay.
From the Alliance Blood War epilogue:
Anduin: The armistice is signed. At long last, the Fourth War is over.
Tyrande: No. Not while the Black Moon still cries out for vengeance. Not until the Horde has answered for its treachery.
Anduin: Further bloodshed will not bring back the fallen. We must renew our hope and forge a future for those who survived.
Tyrande: And when the next warchief musters an army, will hope save you if it is Stormwind that burns?
Anduin: I know itās difficult to trust, but there are signs of change within the Horde.
Anduin: In place of a warchief, there is now a council led by Baine, Thrall, and the others. I believe they canā
Tyrande: Your faith is naive, lion son. I will sign no treaty unless it is written in the Bansheeās blood!
Genn: There is truth in her words, Anduin.
Genn: Peace may be on the table today, but soon enough the Horde will sound their drums and march for war.
Genn: When that day comes, no scrap of parchment will hold them back.
Anduin: The path to peace will not be easy, and not all will choose to walk it.
Anduin: But this is the only way to build a better future. I believe it will work, Genn.
Anduin: It has to
From the Legion Dalaran intro
Archmage Khadgar says: Then Iāll get right to the point. For the Kirin Tor to fight at full strength, we need the mages of the Horde to join our ranks.
Lady Jaina Proudmoore says: NEVER! Do you hear me, Khadgar?
Archmage Khadgar says: Jaina, we know the pain youāve endured. But this is aboutā
Lady Jaina Proudmoore says: They obliterated Theramore. They left us to die on the Broken Shore. Again and again theyāve proven to be monstersā¦ cowards!
Archmage Khadgar says: Iāve made my case. With respect, I move for a vote.
Lady Jaina Proudmoore says: Very well. But consider your choice carefully. If you let those vermin back into this city, I will not be counted among your ranks when you welcome them.
Archmage Khadgar says: In the matter of allowing the Horde into Dalaran and offering membership in the Kirin Tor, I vote aye.
Archmage Karlain says: Aye.
Archmage Vargoth says: Aye.
Lady Jaina Proudmoore says: Nay.
Archmage Ansirem Runeweaver says: Nay.
Archmage Modera says: Aye.
Archmage Khadgar says: The vote carries. Iām sorry, Jaina, but the stakes are higher than theyāve ever been.
Archmage Modera says: Jaina, pleaseā¦ we are doing whatās best for Azeroth. Stand with us!
Lady Jaina Proudmoore says: This Council is blind to the truth. When the Horde betrays you again, remember who warned you. Farewell.
Jaina teleports away, and Khadgar walks over to take her place.
Archmage Khadgar says: That wasā¦ difficult. But we must move forward. We will send our invitation to the Warchief at once. We have a war to win.
From the Horde side of the Purge of Dalaran. Please note that Lorāthemar openly admits the belfs helped Garrosh get the Bell:
Archmage Aethas Sunreaver: āProudmoore! Sheās gone and expelled the Sunreavers from the city. Sheās purging the Horde from the Kirin Tor!ā
Lorāthemar Theron āSheās gone too far. Iām certain the Alliance can move their war Mages through the city at will. That human ā¦witch! When will they learn? When will they see that the Horde exists BECAUSE of the Alliance? Because of their prejudice and their bigotry!? They force us ever closer to Hellscreamās Horde.ā
Archmage Aethas Sunreaver: My Lordā¦
Lorāthemar Theron: Halāduron, summon the rangers. Rommath, assemble the Blood Magi, and add the Sunreaversā strength to your own. We Sinādorei will take our future into our own hands. And get this damn thing out of my sight! Hellscream bought this treasure with the blood of my people. I hope it destroys him.
Couldnāt find the quotes but in the aftermath of the Purge, Varian also Jaina because he was on the verge of getting the Belves into the Alliance, something never mentioned before or again.
From the Wowpedia page on Alterac Valley
Vanndar Stormpike has been given orders from Ironforge against making peace with the orcs, and appears to agree with the orders. He dismisses the orcs as āsavages trying to halt Ironforgeās sovereign imperialistic imperativeā. He wants to slaughter all orcs including DrekāThar, believing that when the General falls, the land will finally turn over to its rightful owner, āIronforgeā. See also, Vanndarās book [The Frostwolf Artichoke: Tales of Stormpike Glory]
I can find more but Iām doing this on mobile and itās a pain.
The point is, thereās an extremely consistent trend of Alliance characters who want to take action against the Horde because of their consistent experience of the Horde being a major source of misery and war, they get shouted down and voted out. When an Alliance character does attack the Horde, they are displayed as unreasonable or an imperialist warmonger or accidentally sabotaged something they didnāt know about and will never be brought up again.
Meanwhile, when the Horde starts a war with the Alliance again, then weāll quickly find out that it was actually just the Royal Apothecary Society/Garrosh loyalists/Sylvanas loyalists and the rest of the Horde are honorable heroes and very upset they had to take part in all those war crimes.
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LoL. Constantā¦ yeah ok.
But letās say youāre right Blizzard is āconstantlyā trying to make Alliance feel bad.
Blizzard to Alliance, " You should feel bad for wanting to take out the Horde."
Blizzard to Horde, "You should feel bad for being Horde. "
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