They’re crying about PVP, which was not the target of the nerfs/rebalance. PVP has never had balance, hopefully this thread can get back on topic of M+ and PvE.
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You only get to use one per four minutes maximum, not both, no matter who you cast them on, and they apply Forbearance to the player that gets them. And me, as a lowly hunter can remove BoP with an instant cast Tranquilizing Shot, instantly. How strong is a 4 or 5 minute cooldown defensive that harms the person that receives it with Forbearance when it’s removable in a second?
In PVE, a player likely would always want every spec to be a bit OP, it’s a team game of actual players versus scripted computers, that’s where balance doesn’t really matter.
Imbalance in pvp has huge ramifications.
And yet, PVP has never had balance.
I love how PVP’ers like you always bring up the “scripted computers” argument. Getting top rank in either PVP or PVE can be difficult, they each present their own challenges. PVP can be cheated and manipulated a lot easier than PVE, and we see that.
Either way, this thread started off talking about the PVE aspect. Let’s keep it that way. If you want to whine about one weakness the class has, go to the PVP threads.
No one tell the hunter about the paladins pony, it’s more fun this way.
If you have to bring up removed skills from the past…your argument is weak. You still haven’t list “most melees and range” classes that have instant mobility. FYI
Now my guy is talking about PVP?
Plus, it doesn’t look like you’re a pusher .1% (gladiator) in pvp so why does it even concern you? It’s like you talking about needing mythic gear to do LFR.
Since you’re a hunter…can you control the distance of disengage? If you can’t, how’s that even consider instant mobility to a mob? You can disengage off a platform, you can disengage into fire? You can disengage past the mob and have to run back which will take longer than a paladins steed running to it. Plus, if you burn disengage and get a movement debuff…can you remove the debuff like a paladin? Answer is no. Think about what you’re saying before posting.
Paladins have mid-range abilities! Why do they need charge or shadow step?
“World of Paladins?”
Why do I need a pvp kill to have a conversation with you? Is that your best comeback?
Again, go re-read my initial post. I want them to buff all class to be equal to paladin. I want ranged builders and spenders. I want my resource removed so I can spam a skill mindlessly without worrying. I need 30 seconds and 1 min dps cool downs and strong passive abilities to dps.
I know how it works.
Tranq shotting bop generally isn’t a guarantee
LoWlEy HuNtEr isn’t a thing
Very strong
Forbearance hasn’t been a meaningful debuff in years and any last semblence of a drawback it had went away with the talent that lets you divine shield regardless of forbearance.
Thanks for telling him he’s got talents that can negate forbearance. Also, who gets to use a defensive during a stun? Paladins.
He is a hunter after all.
Or DK, lol.
Long story short, the nerf was not in anyway concerned about PVP. It was directed at Paladin overall, trying to move damage from a passive to the rest of it’s ability.
It wouldn’t be a nerf, more of trade, we get a instant gap closer and act likeva melee class and lose out on some range. It even benefits some of our dps mechanics (example the talent EL, gives a free DS, but you don’t get it’s full damage unless your in melee range.)
But they are? They move your charecter instantly from one location to the other. They are balanced to be their escape skills.
But paladins needs an instant gap closer. Death grip on DK’s is a gap closer, also they have 2 skills that effects movement also.
It’s not instant for one and easily countered.
Several classes has our bubble, and on top of that several classes cam remove said bubble.
And yet you want paladins to be ranged?
You can be cced by magical effects during spell warding. And can be easily dispelled by purge effects.
Yeah…Blessing of Spellwarding certainly wards 0 spells that are CC. Kinda funny to see (not be) a paladin use Blessing of Spellwarding to be protected from a DH or Caster just to die while being in a fear from a Warrior, or a fear from a priest or warlock, and then killed by me. Shield of Vengeance isn’t mentioned in these conversations because it is removed by one strong attack and nobody notices their damage go down if divine protection is used. The big brain strat of force bubble and then kill the paladin is just as valid now as ever, especially with such pathetic healing (in PVP) from WoG.
Looks like I’ll be testing out some Frost DK. Obliterate does more damage than Hammer of Light and Frost Strike does more damage than Final Verdict by a long shot.
I pvped maybe 5 days worth of hours this expansion, got 2300 in Blitz season one on MM(because MM was pretty good for S1). I would love to play more, but I am dissatisfied with Ret design and tuning, and MM started to get nerfed during S1 so I played that less too. I played as Ret as it is my main in my heart, and it has glaring flaws enemies do exploit. I only made a hunter because at the time that I made a hunter in dragonflight, on my paladin I could be killed in about 3 seconds from a hunter. If bubble and BoP were on cool down, or about three seconds after bubble and buff were dispelled or removed after eight seconds on its own. Playing as marksmanship hunter, it is not difficult to survive and kite a paladin during Divine Shield. Living long enough to chain stun a paladin after Divine Shield or BoP and kill them during Forbearance is hilariously easy, but my love for paladin makes that sad for me. Palatan’s other defensives and minuscule self healing does not allow for lengthy fights, it doesn’t have the durability, it has a melee only range stun, movement and damag buffs are so telegraphed it is an easy target for CC. Its effectiveness just doesn’t keep up with what else is out there. If Retribution has to be terrible, that’s fine, I will play something else as I did for most of dragonflight, but it’s a topic of discussion. I keep coming back to the topic because I’d love to play my preferred spec. That is if it wasn’t the mathematically and designed inferior to its competition. Because of PVP specific tuning, Retribution could be the best spec that exists for PVE, while at the same time being, one of the worst DPS specs for PVP. Because of this, I don’t fault people that have never PVPed as Ret in the last expansion or two to understand what the problem is. Almost every single passive or active ability or talent, and the pvp talents have PVP specific nerfs right now for retribution, and it’s losing the more useful PVP talents for 11.1. Blizzard got sick of nerffing the PVP talents and they just deleted them instead. It’s alright, I’ll shut up and go play it death knight and start gripping everybody into the melee deathball for kicks and keep knocking players to the abyss from steath as MM.
Spell warding stops priest/lock fear as they aren’t physical school like it is for warrior.
You know, I really wish that was the case.
I don’t know who decided this, but the requirement for Blessing of Spellwarding to function is damage. If fear as a spell, caused damage, then it would probably ward that spell, but the spell does not cause damage, so spellwarning does nothing for fear.
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You can’t have 1 class be able to be immune to everything.
No one is asking for that.
What we are asking is to not be torn up like paper after our only good defensive and a instant gap closure like every other melee has.
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Oh I know that Im just saying if one class was to get every tool to deal with every problem why bother playing anything else. And you have a great gap closer in the form of one of the longest stuns in game, sure they can trinket it but as I said if one class had an answer to everything why would anyone play anything else?
You have mortal strike ret doesn’t, you have instant mobility, multiple kinds, and Ret doesn’t. You have a disarm and Rets doesn’t. You have a stronger slow and you can remove Blessing of Protection and Divine Shield and spell reflect hammer of justice and execution sentence. And thanks to this expansion’s tuning and design, you have more burst damage and more sustain damage than Ret. A warrior partner is almost required to do arena for ret, because of everything that you bring. If ret succeeds, it’s because of a partner like a warrior not because of itself.
It’s more than not having every tool, ret has almost no tools that are not counterable by many specs.
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Hun I have a Paladin too Max level. I know exactly how the two classes play.
Steed is just a sprint with an extra graphic, and is a horrible gap closer. Great gap closures is herioc leap, shadowstep, death grip, charge.
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