So I’ve seen people say that Sunwell isn’t that hard and that pre-nerf Vashj is the hardest fight we’ll ever get in TBCC. This is strange to me as the horror stories of M’uru I’ve heard makes me think that SWP will at least be as hard as pre-nerf Vashj or is this just a “back then it was hard” moment and in fact isn’t hard at all because the general player is just better?
I also can’t remember correctly but I think I recall a dev saying that they’re thinking of buffing SWP in an interview that I can’t find so that might’ve just been a hopeful fever dream.
The Isle of Quel’Danas is going to be hell for PvP servers, I’m obviously an Alliance Mage and my server (Arugal) is 64% horde (according to Ironforge.pro) which sure isn’t as bad as other servers but you can still feel the inbalance.
What are your thoughts on this, I’ve never played WoW outside of Classic so every raid and expansion is my first time experiencing it but with everything we know about the game there aren’t really any new things to find out which is why I look up the fights right before the content drops. Some people might not like that and would want to retain what little mystery they can guard but I’m sure that many people in your guild don’t do that and even if you know what to do it doesn’t really speak for how difficult/chaotic it’ll actually be.
Every fights been solved and there’s no mystery about any mechanics so I don’t think it’s going to be an impossible task for anyone who wants it cleared.
Blizzard removes the pushback from M’uru, but doesn’t buff the boss in any way. Guilds that struggled against pre-nerf Vashj/KT one-shot M’uru as if it was nothing more than SWP’s Voidreaver. \o/
Let’s wait and see. I remember a lot of people saying everyone would steamroll naxx and while many guilds did there were also many just hardstuck on 4 horsemen. I think sunwell will probably be the same.
Much like SSC and TK, they are leaving the original versions up, instead of the nerfed raids
Unsure how hard the original version is, but I’d really hope to see some challenging content. If TBC ends with a smooth easy clean KJ kill I will be incredibly disappointed. Phase 3 is an absolute joke, farming this phase for 6 months for all of this gear just to waltz to an easy KJ will be a huge F.
Pretty much this. However, I don’t think Brutalus will be nearly the gear-check he once was. Everyone will be rolling in with BiS everything, and so long as the healers aren’t falling asleep, that fight will not be a progression point.
Sunwell is the most difficult content ever implemented by Wow it rivals even that of 40m Naxx and make today’s mythic lvl raids look like trivial 5 man dungeons
Back in the day yes it was. Today not really. A lot of sun wells challenge came from dps checks that looking at sunwel vids we are well past that level of dps many guilds were past it in p2 gear.
This means the main two hard bosses marru and brutalus are gut. As brutalus was only brutal due to the high damage requirement and keeping healers from ooming in that time from the large amounts of damage. Fight will be shorter without the dps requirement meaning much to upper guilds. Yes mid/lower guilds willl have more issues but sunwel they used to not even be able to kill boss 1 so that’s a night and day diff.
Marru is only hard due to dps requirement nothing else. The pushback is bad yes and makes it hard to heal but dosebt prevent healing and with mobs dieing faster the healing required is reduced. This also means more time in boss with adds dieing faster shortening fight while making it quite a bit easier to time the transition. The reason he was hard was timing the trans to have no adds when you push so can go hard into the burn without adds as the extra damage would kill you and can’t spare dps to kill after trans. With todays dps there will be time between waves and a decent bit at that even adding pushback making it’s vastly easier.
Wasn’t Muru a really big DPS check? Not a straight patchwerk fight, but I thought once they did an HP nerf it it really helped guilds get through it.
The point being that any boss that was stymied by DPS performance likely will not be difficult for guilds to get through. Like I know Illidan wasn’t crazy hard for players, but a lot of guilds are just ignoring the Demon phase due to huge number pumping.
I’m going to guess KJ will be difficult, and maybe one other boss slows people down a bit, but that’s it. Not that I have the SWP knowledge to back it up, but that’ll be my guess.
It’s going to be too easy. EVEN with pre nerf content. They need to buff boss HP significantly to compensate for how good gamers are today. An entire phase of Illidan is being skipped since week one of BT. That’s a huge red flag for future content.
One of the primary reasons content was harder back in the day is because your average raid group wasn’t as geared as they are now. People are better geared and more prepared than ever. There is only one reasonable avenue to preserve authenticity in terms of difficulty in the game. They have to increase boss HP to compensate for more damage being done to bosses.
It’s amazing that they claim to care about an authentic experience and but don’t seem to care that guilds are skipping an entire phase of the final boss of phase 3.
Vashj was only hard due to RNG mechanics and high throughput requirements, which is basically what SWP will be, minus some of the RNG.
Kalecgos is very by-the-numbers and just needs setup for groups to rotate, but is otherwise a very simple and easy fight.
Brutallus is Patchwerk 2.0, with most of the fight being fixated on having sufficient DPS to go the distance and maintain it for 5 minutes. The taunt swap is boring and easy, and Healers now should be more than well equipped to manage Burn, so really it comes down to your kill times. If you’re already skipping Illidan’s demon within phase, you’re already where you need to be more or less.
Felmyst is literally just avoiding the MC gas. With Paladins being so common the adds won’t be hard to round up and the damage isn’t really all that intense with a modicum of focus.
Twins have a few strategies so I can’t actually tell what we’ll end up doing, but rest assured everyone is going to go for the bonus loot kill order. Expect hang-ups here if you got stopped along the way at any point through T6 or never got pre-nerf KT/Vashj down.
Muru is a horror show only because timers are tight, lots of things to snag aggro on and AoE down, and damage is all over the place in P2. There’s also the stupid gravity things in P2 that can chase your better DPS and/or Healers and leave you in a lurch, so there’s some RNG for you as well. However, like any add-wave-management fight, the moment you get yourself some breathing room, the fight goes from strained to hilariously boring really fast. Our DPS and threat focused Tanks are going to make this fight a lot easier than memory serves and P2 shouldn’t last too long.
Kil’jaeden is just a semi-lengthy song and dance to memorize. Stack for this, spread for that, repeat. Damage is obviously very high and you can’t be slow on DPS, but at that point I doubt anyone is struggling to pump out ridiculous numbers.
Unlike prior content, the difference here in SWP is that if you screw up a mechanic, you’re probably dead and so are other people, and if you and others die, DPS checks become harder or impossible, or healing requirements can’t be maintained, etc. Supremus is a goofy encounter that can probably be 10-manned, allowing even absolutely terrible guilds to still kill him even if the first kite-phase wrecks half the raid. You don’t get that kind of luxury in SWP.
If I’m being 100% honest, Archimonde, as easy as he is, is most similar to some of the SWP difficulty. He is generally a very easy fight but singular key mistakes can snowball your entire raid to death if a silence hits at the wrong time.
This is why I xferred to PvE at the start, and I even asked about it for BlizzCon or w/e, and they answered, and the answer was a big fat “we’ll keep an eye on it”
I knew the Isle was PvP fun… provided you weren’t getting stomped by 20+ people. Classic servers have been nothing but murder-ball stomps and I wasn’t going to hate myself trying to stealth around and snag a few mob kills before getting exploded just to do some, not even all, of the Isle dailies that people absolutely need to do to open up Isle content.
Felmyst and Twins have my vote for first real hard-check for unprepared people. DPS haven’t had to move around too much all expansion outside of Vashj puddles and a few preset spread mechanics. You can’t really zerg through 4 people getting MC’d on the first drive by or the entire raid getting debuffed on Twins at the wrong time.
I was on Gilneas back in TBC it was an RP-PVP server, and IQD was amazingly fun pvp but back then most everyone on an RP-PVP server was down for PVP and/or RP based PVP. Having whole guilds doing quests to ensure everyone could get their dailies done, putting bounties on players for griefing. At least at the time it was an engagement tool especially after so long without WPVP due to flying mounts.