Then throw your hat in the ring and join in the fun. Beats tediously re-treading the same old arguments over and over.
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That isn’t how druid shapeshifting works. You don’t become a copy of an existing animal. Your natural shape changes to match the idea of the animal you are turning into. Back in Vanilla you needed to undergo a spirit journey and commune with the spirit of the bear to gain your bear form. This involved listening to the spirit speak of the ideals it represents and telling the player that they must learn these ideals and uphold them to learn how to turn into a bear.
This is also why your hair/skin color effects the color of your animal form. You’re not turning into just any tiger. You’re turning into yourself expressed as a tiger.
This is also why druids retain their intelligence when they transform. Malfurion’s bear form is still Malfurion and thus has his intelligence and memories. It is just Malfurion as he would be as a bear.
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Not true… by the time of Vol’jinn’s rebellion, the Horde had been completely expelled from Ashenvale.
I am not sure why I should treat something as Canon when Blizzard doesn’t even do so.
Given their experience, and the nature of the terrain in question, there have been crazier things to have happened irl.
Oh yeah?
Link the source. Don’t explain it. Don’t describe it.
Link it.
Lie.
You keep forgetting that I play both factions despite my avatar being blue.
Nevermind that Tyrande wouldn’t have needed to request Ashenvale if the Horde had been removed from it.
Of repeatedly losing, they would lose? Agreed.
Well, he killed Lorash, who otherwise would have wiped out every Night Elf in Kalimdor.
Well, that’s technically what orcs are. The Titans engineered them to kill plants.
Oh, ya got anudda plan? I got anudda plan, too. I let ya siege Orgrimmar on ya own. See how far ya get. An’ once da city be filled wit’ corpses, den me shadow hunters come in, we mop up what left, kill Kor’kron an Alliance alike. Give ya dead ta Sylvanas. Hmm! I save a lot a Darkspear lives wit’ dis plan!
Mmnn? You don’t like? Then, we stay wit’ da fist plan. We work together.
We don’t even have ta like each other.
[Call his bluff] Why don’t WE wait until YOU attack Orgrimmar, then mop up YOUR dead?*
<Vol’jin sees his opportunity slipping away. He holds up his hands.>
Wait now, ! Orgrimmar be a fortress. My people, we ain’t gonna crack dat nut on our own. How long we gonna last out here? Days? Weeks? Vol’jin can’t say.
You keep da supplies comin, an’ I promise, more Kor’kron gonna die. Before ya troops even land! The blood bein’ spilt ain’t even ya own! Surely dat be worth a few crates of meat?
Wrathion says: I thought [Hellscream’s] victory was assured before he turned half his Horde against him. So I changed my allegiance.
Wrathion says: Oh, don’t look so surprised! I am a black dragon. My loyalties are my own.
Wrathion says: But that idiot, IDIOT Wrynn! “High King” indeed!
Wrathion says: Why did he allow another [warchief]? He could’ve united the world under the Alliance banner. What a fool I was to trust his ambition!
Nope, it’s pretty well established. The Horde either pulled back to defend Ogrimmar or joined with the rebellion. Even if they weren’t fully pushed out of Ashenvale, the Horde wouldn’t of had anyone defending the occupied territory anyway.
Given their thousands of years of knowing the land intimately.
But go ahead, resort you petty quips, wouldn’t be the first tantrum from you.
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I beg to differ. I’d say it needs a pair of shoes, at least… but to each their own.
That doesn’t say that the Alliance has garrosh beaten. That’s the Alliance forcing Vol’jin to beg for help.
The Alliance was soundly Garrosh’s whipping boy (all the way since Cataclysm!) until the end of MoP, at which point the guy who made that Dwarf comic with Lo Ping made a tweet about the Alliance becoming The Power while the Horde was pretty much the whipping boy until BFA started.
Edit: Whoops was Metzen, not Kosak.
https://treehealsgowoosh.wordpress.com/2013/11/19/the-alliance-superpower/
So basically you’re confirming what I said. Wrathion thought Garrosh was a sure bet until the Horde went civil war.
Okay. Source it. Source where the Horde pulled all forces out of Ashenvale to reinforce Orgrimmar.
And still lost Ashenvale.
Twice.
Edit: Sorry, spaced BFA
Thrice.
Man those thousands of years of strategy and wisdom sure did help with being tricked didn’t they?
So is you continually saying that the faction that wasn’t defeated and didn’t surrender somehow “lost” the war.
To be fair, I would have said the exact same thing about Darkshore, but they somehow managed that.
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Winners dont have government changes
From A Good War:
- The night elf fleet had returned. Perhaps the ships had been waiting—just out of sight beyond the edge of the coast—for the Horde to walk into Malfurion’s trap. Now they could fire uncontested on the Horde army.
The night elves have found their miracle. The Horde could not hold the shore. It would be a slaughter if they did not retreat. “Back to the trees! Back to Ashenvale!” Saurfang called out. His subordinates picked up the cry, and soon, the Horde was moving. Retreating. Alliance fire chased them all the way into the cover of the forests to the east.
Sylvanas did not move. She barely even glanced at the ocean. Saurfang and his guards remained near her at the edge of the northern forest. The fleet would not fire upon them, not here, so close to their departed ancestors.
“The night elves have outmaneuvered us, High Overlord,” Sylvanas said. She sounded irritated.
“Yes, they have.”
“We cannot advance into this forest, and we cannot bring our siege weapons onto the shore without losing them,” she said. “The Alliance’s reinforcements will arrive before we can break this the hard way. Do you disagree?”
“No, Warchief.” Saurfang could not imagine a solution that would work. And yes, the “hard way” would take too long, if it worked at all. Maybe— maybe —with some teamwork between magi, warlocks, and shaman, the Horde could force the wisps back one tree at a time and then destroy the tree, eliminating cover inch by inch. But managing it all while under attack from the water? It would take weeks. The Alliance reinforcements would arrive, making it impossible to cross the waters from Darkshore.
As it stood, the night elves would win this battle.
Now the Horde needed a miracle.
Because the Night Elves do not attack the Horde when the Horde is not on Night Elf lands. The Night Elves haven’t ever, and still won’t, go after the Horde’s homes to take them.
Not according to Elegy:
- Anaris Windwood was a genuine war hero many times over, most recently during the Cataclysm. Silverwind Refuge, which had been a major outpost in Ashenvale along with Astranaar, had once lived up to its name—a welcoming place with a comparatively luxurious inn. But the upheaval of the natural order caused by the Cataclysm—and an influx of orcs—had changed everything.
The orcs had slaughtered Sentinels and civilians alike.
Cordressa had not seen it with her own eyes, but the orcs had reportedly hunted down those who tried to flee, letting their bodies rot in the road as a brutal warning to anyone who would try to retake Silverwind Refuge.
It wasn’t until Anaris arrived with a small army of Sentinels that Silverwind Refuge was reclaimed for the night elves. Now, it once again served as a center of Ashenvale’s Sentinel presence.
“Anaris Windwood,” Delaryn murmured, her voice soft with awe. “I did not know she stayed on after her victory!”
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Yes they do. We have government changes every 4-8 years in the US, and we’re not even in a war.
Also, I didn’t say the Horde won. Neither side won. Both sides just decided to stop fighting.
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Now you want sources? After all the false declarative statements you have made? Lol.
Okay, the quest in Ashenvale where you have to reassemble Dartol’s Rod was with the explicit intention of Weaponizing the Furbolgs. They used them to retake Silverwind refuge. Then the quest chain moved on to kill the commander and ambassador at the Warsong Lumber Camp, stamping out the last lingering Horde presence in Ashenvale.
Once… and the Horde still failed every objective, and suffered more military casualties.
Oh.
Farbeit for me to say that books aren’t canon.
Sounds like the elves retroactively got their fort back.
They do. They have. During the Siege of Orgrimmar.
Wolfheart
Cataclysm Ashenvale Quest Chain
War of Thorns
All three times the Night Elves failed to defend Ashenvale successfully on their own.
yeah we vote for a president, the horde literally deposed a king
That’s not really a valid comparison. The make up of the government changes, but the structure of having the 3 branches of government or w/e stays the same. The Horde completely changed the structure of how it governs. From having a Warchief to a Council. It’d be like instead of voting for a new president, we removed the executive branch all together or replaced the executive branch with something else.
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I just said I don’t take Wolfheart as canon because Blizzard doesn’t seem to either.
Already explained why that book is problematic
Which was a series of failed attacks by the Horde, followed by a totally victory for the Kaldorei.
Good job, you won. Also failed every objective you set out to do, and suffered massive casualties.
Wait the Night Elves helped the Horde deal with their corrupt warchief and now you’re blaming them for that?
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