I’m going to go ahead and end this thread here under the following facts:
As alliance we have always enjoyed dominance in AV from inception till today.
As alliance we have always enjoyed sucking - even with Every Man For himself was a thing in all other BGs and we should have been the dominant faction.
In pug v pug in AB and WSG we still lose more frequently than horde.
The following logical explanation is that we just don’t play as well and people who value pvp for fun did not roll our faction.
It is not the horde’s fault. It is not alliance’s fault. It is just how it is. You can cry about horde outnumbering us, but it simply doesn’t matter since it is set numbers in BGs.
In Premade vs Premade players do very well against each other meaning faction doesn’t matter. Racials aren’t making the difference. You think Orc Stun resist matters AT ALL when you’re fighting a premade and we have 3 pallies?
Yeah, nope. Sure doesn’t.
So, please, keep making threads to prove we are just cry baby brainless incels. The fact that we even try to twist logic, facts, and reason to create some divine reason why we’re the hind nipple in pvp makes me laugh.
TL;DR - Ally suck. Stop sucking and we will win. It’s that simple.
The facts you give don’t track at all. There were many times that BG were pretty even between the factions and there were even times the alliance dominated BG.
Things change with patches, strategies, relative amounts of players, psychological factors between the factions, and even external factors. It’s not always one side is better than the other, rather the environment around the game brings out certain characteristics in each side.
It’s weird, a quick 2 minute google search shows the EU horde has a 95% win rate in AV as well… People keep saying this doesn’t affect other regions, then why are they reporting it as well?
There’s literally tons of old waybackmachine posts from forums crying about ally win ratio, devo interviews saying ally won most, and from MOP on MMO-Champ graphs showing ally W/L ratios.
That’s in relation to AV. As far as pugs, ally was always a little less than 50% outside of that, depending on battlegroup for the rest of the BGs.
I don’t have personal knowledge of win rates in other regions. All I can talk to is that different strats have different results.
Alliance and horde generally split wins when it’s rush vs rush. The games are quick and both sides get very good rewards per hour.
The horde turtle strat results in nearly 100% horde wins but the games take 4 or 5 times as long. Horde get much more rewards than the alliance. The end result is alliance don’t queue anymore and horde queues are astronomical.
Do other regions play one way or the other? All I have is reports of win rates and play styles, I can’t verify if they are correct.
Could it possibly be, now hear me out, that the virtually instant queue for alliance, combined with a guaranteed 1 MoH regardless of loss, is is possible that the alliance simply do not put effort into anything beyond rush?
Alliance know full well that a fast loss with least effort equates to at worst, a fast requeue for another MoH. You cannot remove the “hurry up and lose” mentality created by cross realm bg and marks of honor.
But I have no doubt you will perpetually blame it on everything but your own faction.
And tons the other way too. At different points each faction dominated. Which one dominated more? It’s pretty muddy, the internet is a tough place to search back more than a few years and a lot of people threw up misinformation back then, just as they do now.
The blue post that clearly showed that alliance historically won more AVs prior to reinforcements, which jives with the experiences of those of us that played during this phase of vanilla, is anything but muddy.
The reason alliance give up in AV is because they know the map is stacked against them. If horde in other regions are zerging and not playing scorched earth like they are in US then there ya go.
And yes it’s kind of amazing horde in the US haven’t figured this out, it’s exactly what happened years ago. Horde started playing scorched earth, alliance boycotted the BG and horde queue times spiked. Exactly what’s happeneing now.
Of course, it’s certainly a factor. Whether through differing psychology involved in faction choice or becoming disheartened over issues in PVP, there certainly has been waning interest on the alliance side.
This doesn’t mean that it’s the only factor or that it was always this way. Many good players have played both sides, a lot of good players switch over to the “winning” side to take advantage of those strengths. Even if it was only a perception thing, those people switching can be a self-fulfilling prophecy.
And then there are faction differences, some of those are good in certain situations and not good in others. For example, one faction ability might be great in a mass, packed battle like at a choke point but not be good on an open field. Another might be great to stop runners with a flag but not do much to take a stationary one. So each BG gets a different contribution from the skill of a player depending on faction, location, strategies, etc.
In AV it’s generally easier to defend against people going south at the field of strife than going north. Yes, this changes a bit in other places in the BG. However, the tone of the battle gets set around the field and that tone influences the overall success of a side.
If alliance can rush past mid then they tend to win because they get to parts of AV where they have a better chance of success. Thus a rush, while risky, can pay off. On the other hand if the horde can turtle then they tend to win because a slow push north favors them at the field of strife.
So we have the main strats both sides attempt. It just happens to be that the horde strat is much more successful in the NA region at this time.
Without rep rewards alliance wouldn’t queue AV at all while horde are playing the way they currently do. You should be thankful alliance get anything for a guaranteed loss.
100% agree. They make excuses but you never see a group of stealthers go past the choke to cap bases (which would cause the group to split to recap it thus making it easier for more to run through), you always see that group of 2 or 3 fishing on the alliance - and it seems that the second the game stops going their way they give up and stop trying (with the exception of 10-15 that keep trying but end up getting stomped due to numbers).
I also feel that AV is designed for alliance to be a fast game and for horde to be a longer game with more objectives captured. Given if the roles were switched and horde had instant queue - it would be the other way. This is pretty much the flaw of vanilla pvp ranking. You cant play to have fun - you play for a certain HPH.
It’s a useless gesture to do that. At best you’ll get 5 or so people to come back and retake. Then those two groups will play cat-and-mouse for a while. The flags don’t usually last long enough to be fully capped so it doesn’t matter and the amount of defenders lost isn’t large enough to matter.
Because a handful of people getting past SHGY is not helpful if horde are playing D. They just end up getting picked off and put right back up north.
Now if there was a second way past SHGY on the east of the map that would be interesting but there’s not.
It’s not designed anyone specific way other than that horde get to pick the pace and there’s little alliance can do about it. Either both sides zerg and we get a ~50% win rate or horde play strong D and have a ~100% win rate and alliance stop queueing. Horde are currently picking option two.
Two groups need to be formed, with a minimum of 5 for Warsong Gulch. Each group’s faction does not matter.
Both group leaders need to have each other on Battle.net Friends list.
One group leader should use the command /wargame [battle.net ID here] warsong to send a challenge to the other group. For example, if my battle.net ID is set to “rokman” you would type " /wargame rokman warsong " to challenge my group to a match. You don’t need the #1234 at the end of a battle.net tag to send a challenge.
Both groups should receive a queue that pops almost instantly and then you are in the match!