You can totally see respect for the Blood Elves’s most watershed moment as a people by saying their decimation and continued tooth-and-nail fight for survival was a “phase”
Blood Elves went through an utterly dramatic cultural shift that has yet to settle, we are even seeing the ripples of it as they grow closer to the horde races.
And yet some people pretend they are basically the same culture they once were…
This. It totally throws out everything Blood Elves have been through since Arthas, when they say, “Blood Elves are High Elves”.
Why can’t Blood Elves be Blood Elves?
I do fin VE’s aesthetically unique, but shallow.
A VE in full Heritage armor looks amazing (I love my rogue) but everything about the is very surface and hardly explored (not to say you can’t come with interesting narratives for your characters) but the lore has barely explored them.
And as for much some people kick and scream that High Elves have no lore, we can name 3 distinct groups of High Elves on the alliance with different contexts, then we have the ones that prefer to be neutral, and even a group of HE’s that disappeared during the cataclysm.
Today I was flying around Nazjatar looking at all the Highborne ruins, and how you can see the direct aesthetic link between them and the Thalassian architecture, and it made me want so hard for QT to be redone with that quality.
Cause it’s not news that I love Blood Elves and what they have become, I love they are a race that was on the alliance but crossed over as a whole. I Like Lor’themar and Liadrin and I’m lowkey shipping him with Thalyssra (can u imagine if they have a baby? I just dig the idea of Highborne kinda remerging)
Those are things I’m looking forward with BE’s.
And I like High Elves exactly because they are not part of that, because they are the road less traveled, but with their own worthy story to tell.
I am just going to address the actual discussion pieces, because most of the discussion is you railing about me in some form or another about possible motivations. These have nothing to do with the discussion of that lore piece.
They would be a new type of elf if that was the case.
Which you have in the form of void elves. So given you have exactly what you are describing already, why do you need high elves and what would they offer that void elves do not presently?
I think the problem with the discussion is it has gotten to the point where its grown overly large when it has no need to be.
That is your interpretation, despite him speaking of game design not lore.
By Lore standards, they are not the same race biologically. Again, there are no thalassian elves who grow tentacles and do not have a connection to the sunwell.
Per Lore, the sunwell is the equivalent of eating and breathing for the elves. It is the source of power from which they draw, which is why when the sunwell disappeared all of their mages were incapable of properly defending themselves and relied upon the rangers, a non-magical class as the primary means of defense.
In terms of magical abilities it is what they draw upon, and it is why they were forced to seek other sources.
This is clearly also suggested strongly in each literature such as blood of the highborne and shadows of the sun. Along with the conclusion of TBC.
This is also why they captured the Naru m’uru and used it to gain power of the light, because without the sunwell, they had no means to do so anymore.
Your passive aggressiveness is showing.
It isn’t going to make me change my mind no matter how snippy you get. I’ll just flat out ignore it per usualy.
Hardly, that is a mental gymnastic loop on your part.
The fifth point does not make the fourth point impossible.
It turns it into an AND statement, not an OR statement.
That is your assertion of what I am doing which is blatantly false. By your own breakdown as well as other sources such as WoD and Blizzcon where they additionally clarrified along with blood of the highborne explaining that the high elves were attuned, its power is accessible anywhere.
Play the game dude.
You do realize that the blood knights gained their power from M’uru and essentially bent the power of light to their will. They were not faith users like other paladins or priests at the time. As such, they then drew their power from the sunwell. This is explained throughout the game.
Also…yes…
They would all immediately lose magical power.
Literally stated over the course of how the blood knights acquired their power.
Yeah, they are, where do you think the paladins got their power prior to the sunwell restoration? They had to force a Naaru to be the source of it.
I tend to approach a discussion from both sides, not just a singular one. So often, I approach the situation with the thought that the individual in front of me is just as informed, and is not going to close their eyes and declare something does not exist.
Again, if what you stated was true and the sunwell’s power was only accessible on Azeroth.
then there would never have been any blood elves or high elves present on Draenor because they would have immediately gone into withdrawal which occurred last time.’
You’re trying to declare something as not being, and ignoring what results if it stops being present.
Probably because TBC happened and restored them?
She was giving him the eye during the recruitment quest.
no citations, im not surprised. nothing has changed culturally in quel’thalas in over 7000 years. none of their traditions have been abandoned. they value their heritage very much and will always carry it with them. changing an adjective will never change this. i highly recommend you do the blood elf heritage armor quest scenario to see what i mean firsthand and how much they value their culture and traditions
its simple really, while they refer to themselves as blood elves now, it is merely to honor their fallen. the race is high elf
no you cant
allerian hold - is a moment stuck in time, the context is the original alliance expedition has managed to survive this whole time(barely). most of the survivors are humans with a few elves sprinkled in. with the portal reopened and sick of fighting, they likely returned to their homeland with their captain auric sunchaser, who now resides in quel’danas and serves as a high elf representative
the lodge elves - are elves who were actually in quel’thalas when arthas attacked and survived. they accepted the rebranding of their people and it wasnt until rommath returned and they rejected his teachings did they get exiled because lorthemar did not want to rule a divided people at such a desperate time. they did not want to leave their homeland and settled south of quel’thalas in the lodges and reverted back to calling themselves ‘high elves’ to show political dissent and how easy it is to change and demean the adjective. quel’lithien is no longer in play, but quel’danil is. they have no interest in the alliance beyond the wildhammer they share the hinterlands with and have a common enemy with the witherbark trolls near by. thats about it for them
the SC - are even easier. they are aligned with the kirin tor of dalaran. my personal belief vereesa has never left the neutrality of dalaran is because of rhonin, who strongly believed in neutrality just as khadgar does now
none of them are alliance aligned, claiming otherwise is your fanfictions. all the alliance have are a few individuals
oh, and as i came to these conclusions so did development. as evidenced when they tell us ‘there are no more alliance high elf hubs left where they could come from’
incoming high elf/half elf concept
so recall my short fanfiction idea entitled the sailing of the farstriders
here we have ship wrecked farstriders, marooned on the dragon isles. there’s a sort of devil’s triangle anomalie off the coast and the farstriders aren’t the first to be ship wrecked there. and the dragons wont let them leave either, keeping the location a secret.
this has resulted in an interesting civilization as different captive races encounter each other in this neutral and rather rarefied environment.
following the concept of the dragon aspects representing different elements, depicted as the primary colors, what if this population on dragon isles is, by virtue of the longevity of elves, mostly half elven of one variety or another, all distinguished by the dragon aspect they are overseen by. for example:
or rather than half dragon, they are half elf and half of one of the various races that also ship wrecked there. this could explain why the dragon aspects, who guard the dragon isles, always choose to mimic elves for the most part, when in non dragon form.
the variants could all be customizations for the same allied race, rather than separate allied races. in other words, you’d have fair skin, red hair for alex. medium skin, blue hair for kalecgos. night elf skinned, green hair for ysera. medium skin, blonde hair, for nozdormu. and dark skinned, dark hair for neltharion (think wrathion’s new model)
then use the slightly thicc’er physique of the aspects for the models. for example this model. but give the models wavy curly hair as an option so they are visually different in not just build but in hair types. an example might be kalecgos blue but short curly, long curly, long straight and short straight. or neltharion black and long-straight, short straight, long curly, short curly. etc.
4 hair styles, 5 hair colors, 4 skin colors.
I feel like Vareesa is still trying to be a leader even though she feels she cant fill that role. When Rhonin was killed this probably deepened this. Rhonin was pretty much the defacto leader of the Kirin Tor and she leaned on this. Now that her sisters have these positions of greatness she probably feels inadequate in a lot of aspects of her life. I feel as if Blizzard could use this. She could potentislly become the strongest of the Windrunner sisters because she does decide to not fall to another source of magic or undeath. She has a lot of potential and I really hope Blizzard sees this and uses it.
While I agree with you on completely discounting the Outland elves and taking them out of the equation…
The faction description of the Silver Covenant literately describes them as an Alliance group. Their description includes the following: They’ve united under the banner of Vereesa Windrunner and joined the Alliance forces in Northrend. Ergo, you’re the one making fanfiction by ignoring they’re part of the Alliance and coming up with your own self-confessed fanfiction in your personal belief.
You are trying everything in the world to try to discount this group, but it hasn’t worked the last ten times. The Covenant are Alliance and the game has supported them being part of the Alliance since Wrath.
yes, northrend. specifically the alliance vanguard which was all the forces of the alliance in northrend, including any friends from the locals they made along the way. the SC help the alliance in the exact same capacity as the sunreavers in northrend and both operate under the umbrella of the kirin tor of dalaran
dalaran is not a part of the alliance or influenced by them. anything they do has to be voted on. after the northrend campaign the SC do not follow the alliance to SW. they follow the kirin tor back to dalaran
if you still arent grasping this, if the us goes to war, canada doesnt automatically back them
and of course development supports me not your fanfictions the SC is not a part of the alliance it is a part of dalaran
Sylvannas attacked various holdings of Dalaran during Cata and raised its citizens into undeath. Sylvannas sure doesn’t seem to think Dalaran is ‘unquestioningly neutral’
Description of Silver Convent: They’ve united under the banner of Vereesa Windrunner and joined the Alliance forces in Northrend
Its part of the Alliance. Sorry. You’re the one coming up with fanfiction trying to pretend we can ignore that.
there is no high elf army or state in the alliance and everybody knows it
no AR aligned with the alliance is going to come from a city open with its neutrality
all the alliance has is a few individuals
Description of Silver Convent: They’ve united under the banner of Vereesa Windrunner and joined the Alliance forces in Northrend
Sure sounds like an High Elven force. You’re now specifiying that it has to be an army or the state, so if that’s a requirement I guess Void Elves can’t be an Allied Race any more given they don’t have a standing army or a state?
Oh, so like how the Nightbourne aren’t a playable race on the Horde? Or the Highmountain Tauren? Or how the Lightforged are a playable race on the Alliance despite being neutral during Leigon and dropping that the minute the larger threat is gone? Or how everything is pointing to Mechagnomes being the next AR for Alliance, alongside Vulpera on the Horde?
all of those races are participating in the faction war. guess which one isnt
literally 3 reported for duty for the alliance willing to put their lives on the line. and they had to put on a 7th legion uniform to do it
I’m sorry, I must have missed when Mechagnomes, the highly developed race only introduced last patch that practically everything is supporting being a new Allied race given the amount of work done on their character model, were involved in the faction war.
Oh, so now they are supporting the faction war is what you’re saying?
I mean, Vereesa turned up during Legion when I got the PvP appearance on my artifact on Alliance side, so I’d say she’s supporting it
i am not counting mechagnomes or vulpera obviously. srs?
i am not denying the SC have alliance sympathies, and when the kirin tor decides it needs to get involved they are allowed to act on those sympathies. the alliance vanguard of northrend and their description during WotLK is no longer relevant in the present. thats really it
Lololol "only three reported for duty. Ive said this 5 times in this thread so therefore im right "
Certain lore is required for certain points of a story/xpac. This has been seen since TBC. People need to understand how Blizzard uses and abuses lore.
The Blood elves are not “identified” by their struggles, they’re identified by their ability to overcome them, as said by Lor’themar himself. This is a trait inherent in their race, not something they suddenly became the moment they changed their names.
Their culture IS inherently High elven, that is what identifies them, and their culture. Lady Liadrin expresses this sentiment during the Nightborne quest where she says that despite the strength they’ve gained from their allies they’ve never forgotten who they are. (referring to who they are before they were devastated by Arthas.) It’s their central theme, their vengeance for the fallen High elf race.
They don’t have to be “exactly” the same to be representative of the race. Every race evolves and changes, but the entire point of the modern High elf evolution is the departure from their Thalassian culture. The game has main strides to make this narrative clear to the player. You must understand why trying to use something that has been deliberately used as a way to separate themselves from traditional high elf culture doesn’t make very much sense.
there are FAR more humans helping the horde in BFA, specifically the fogsail pirates, then the 3 alliance high elves in the faction war. and as you well know if political opinion was enough to give the other faction access to a horde race, the faction concept would be pointless and you would have playable alliance high elves. you could be 1 of those 3 and i could be a fogsail pirate
You’re asserting that when a High Elf is changed, by any magic, they become a completely new species – which means, then, that you believe one of two things:
OR
You choose, I’m fine with either. 
I didn’t realize that when he said, and I quote, “Void Elves are pretty much another flavor of High Elves”, he’d intoned he was specifically and exclusively referring to gameplay.
Oh, that’s because he didn’t – not to mention that the ~90 seconds of dialogue were all completely narrative-related.
You mean by Warcraft According to Broflake standards, because there isn’t a single shred of evidence in the actual lore to imply they’re a biologically distinct species – they’re Blood Elves, immersed with the Void.
If it’s such a clear reality, you won’t have any trouble actually proving it with any source.
You just made my point. They aren’t required to exclusively utilize the Sunwell, which means it’s entirely plausible that the BE’s in Draenor are using something else – and plausible becomes probable when we recall that the only commentary we’ve ever had about the Sunwell’s reach is that it can be accessed anywhere on Azeroth.
Not anywhere in the universe, anywhere on Azeroth.
This isn’t concise enough for me to even figure out what you’re saying.
They don’t require the Sunwell, specifically, they require magical energy. You know what both Draenor and Outland have? You guessed it, magical energy.
What’s more likely?
The first option requires someone to believe something that Blizzard has stated isn’t true, the second option requires someone to believe that the HE’s and BE’s did something they’ve both done numerous times by this point.