Hey Blizzard, Classic Dungeons Are Fun

[Kem-bleeding-hollow]

I guess you only did Molten Core.

[Avagon-sisters-of-elune]

Yes, you are grasping at straws. Also, you apparently don’t read. Barron has six different abilities that all need to be considered and acted upon during the fight.

How is one ability being described and 5 different possible ways to tactically deal with that one ability equivocate to 6 abilities? lol. She possesses people. That’s it. Adding a bullet point that says, “Hunters should auto shoot the boss or the player that she possesses!” doesn’t magically mean there’s a new ability in the fight, which is literally what 5 of those things are. Derp. Yes, you’re absolutely grasping at straws. Classic boss fights are going to be braindead easy in comparison to Retail. Pretending otherwise is just laughable.

That said, that’s not necessary for classic dungeons to be fun. I don’t get why people are pretending that it’s because they’re mechanically difficult. Hell, as a level capped hunter in the beta right now I spend the bulk of my time autoattacking because I either don’t have the mana to do anything else or my one meaningful damage ability besides serpent sting is on cooldown. Woo, that’s so super complicated guys!

There are lots of things about Classic that are so much more fun than Retail. Seeing the same people leveling in the world as I saw leveling in the newbie zone, helping each other out with quests as people get overwhelmed because they pulled too much or a respawn happened, running dungeons and friending people that are good because we want to have people to contact later to do stuff together, the list goes on and on. There’s a lot of convenience stuff that was great when it was implemented but it chipped away at the immersiveness and connection people had to the world bit by bit until we now have this frantic gogogo mentality because nothing we do matters after the current tier ends.

As silly as this sounds it reminds of a line from one of the bad Matrix sequels where the Architect is talking about how he made the perfect utopian world and humanity couldn’t handle it, that they needed strife and conflict and challenge and risk and danger so they made a flawed world. Sometimes the flaws are the fundamental parts of an experience and removing them isn’t an improvement.

[Kem-bleeding-hollow]

Retail doesn’t have complex mechanics either.

End of the day, it’s which experience is better. Looking like Classic.

[Galdor-maelstrom (Galdor)]

… those are the abilities of the mobs that are spawned with Reaping. You asked to name a Mythic+ mechanic that wasn’t in Classic.

Mobs dying and remaining as ghosts at the spot they died, then reanimating and running at you from their death points, to wherever you are in the dungeon is a mechanic that is not in Classic.

[Kem-bleeding-hollow]

It’s almost like 90% of the things we’ve seen in SEVEN xpacs aren’t in classic. Big brain.

[Avagon-sisters-of-elune]

Retail doesn’t have complex mechanics either.

Actually that’s just simply not true. That’s actually a design philosophy that you can see trending upwards in complexity over time if you look at the boss fights from Vanilla through Retail. In fact, the whole point of fights now is make people juggle so many things that they make a mistake because it’s this neverending war between addons making things easier to spot and react to and them adding another layer of complexity as “difficulty”. If you’re pretending that the fights in Retail aren’t mechanically complex in comparison you’re being dishonest. And I don’t get why. Clearly fights don’t have to be mechanically complex to be fun. Hell, classes don’t have to be mechanically complex to be fun. That’s what Classic shows us. That the other parts of the game are far more important, and in particular that the social aspect that’s been removed over time is huge factor in what’s missing from Retail.

[Argorwal-ysera (Argorwal)]

Would be nice to get some bigger dungeons like Blackrock Depths, that isn’t made for mythic+ to be speedrun through, something with puzzles, secret doorways, secret bosses, a story.

Legion and BFA are the only 2 expansions to release large scale dungeons similar to vanilla.

[Galdor-maelstrom (Galdor)]

It’s almost like 90% of the things we’ve seen in SEVEN xpacs aren’t in classic. Big brain.

Hey, kid, that’s what the OP wanted. He wanted someone to name a Mythic+ mechanic that wasn’t in Classic:

Name a mythic+ mechanic that you don’t think was in Classic.

[Argorwal-ysera (Argorwal)]

Retail doesn’t have complex mechanics either.

End of the day, it’s which experience is better. Looking like Classic.

Why no 9/9?

You are way overgeared and there arent any complex mechanics.

[Diro-stonemaul (Diro)]

Mobs dying and remaining as ghosts at the spot they died, then reanimating and running at you from their death points, to wherever you are in the dungeon is a mechanic that is not in Classic.

Um… did you not run Sunken Temple?

Seriously, you’re obviously trying to talk about an experience that’s being made very clear you didn’t engage in.

[Huntillia-proudmoore (Huntillia)]

This seems like something you’re very passionate about…

[Frostchi-nerzhul (Frostchi)]

• Crowd control was generally useful and in some cases near-mandatory depending on group comp and level differentials. In today’s WoW AoE burn it down mentality (and design) makes crowd control more of a rarity at best. It’s used, but it’s not really as make-or-break, and I wish it weren’t the case because crowd control and the like feel like they separate the wheat from the chaff.
• Methodic pace was the name of the game. You didn’t blast through at high speed in most dungeons unless you outleveled or geared it to some extent. Each dungeon felt like an understaking, and even though that slowed the pace of gearing up, it made the dungeon itself feel more like an adventure. Current dungeons feel like something that I simply tick the boxes for a loot pinata.
• Relevance of threat, patrols, and adds, was a thing. The threat based tanking might not be everyones cup of tea, and that’s OK, but to me that matters. Yes, it might be 15-20 seconds of letting the tank beat stuff before I start, but it could be punishing if you didn’t. It meant that there were rules to be respected, and the world felt like you were it’s play thing if you weren’t careful. Patrols could ruin your day if you weren’t attentive, and adds were something that you did everything you could to avoid.
• Time commitment mattered. There wasn’t really this sense that a 15-20 minute run was the normal expectation. We all have responsibilities, of course, so three hour dungeons aren’t necessarily ideal. At the same time, a dungeon just doesn’t feel “substantial” when the play style is “burn through it so I can leave in 15 minutes”.
• Atmosphere of a dungeon was more of a dungeon “crawl” as one person said. This meant that, for me, it felt like we were penetrating the depths of an enemy bastion or lair. By contrast, most modern dungeons burn by so fast that it doesn’t “feel” like anything but a race to the loot.
• Personal responsibility mattered a lot. It might have been annoying to have mobs you have to interrupt in every dungeon, and it might be annoying to have to babysit a crowd controlled mob while also pulling your weight, but it was important. It was important because not doing so could lead to a wipe. It might have felt boring or tedious to some people, but it meant that your job had actual value beyond faceless damage.

Hear hear! well said

[Kem-bleeding-hollow]

I can tell you from my personal raid history(top 100 world in WoD, and top 10 allstar warlock for multi tiers).

It’s a up and down and not only upward. Take the first tier of most xpacs for example, they’re usually a complete joke and can be done in a few hours first clear, but Highmaul for example was one of if not THE hardest starting raid in the entire history of WoW.

As for class play. Lol. Warlock is the hardest class to play in the game. I can pick up a new spec in 10 minutes of trying it. I’m already dropping 90% parses on Shadow, BM, and Enhance, haven’t played them in years.

Fun factor comes in to the people and experience doing the raids/dungeons. I’d rather do 10 man dungeons in classic than any M+ in current WoW with it’s terrible design and horrible balancing.

The difficulty has hardly gone up, infact it has gone down since WoD ended. Legion legendarys were a massive nerf to the content in Legion.

[Huntillia-proudmoore (Huntillia)]

Impressive…

[Galdor-maelstrom (Galdor)]

I have a higher legacy PvP title than you, I obviously played the game. Where in Sunken Temple does the Reaping affix appear? I don’t remember as I haven’t played Vanilla since 2006.

[Kem-bleeding-hollow]

I raid 1 day a week in a casual guild. Time=/=difficulty.

I’ve been top 100, don’t need to prove myself to a nobody.

[Kem-bleeding-hollow]

No, it just seems like something you know nothing about.

[Huntillia-proudmoore (Huntillia)]

Know nothing about what?

[Diro-stonemaul (Diro)]

How is one ability

6 abilities:

• Cleave
• Mortal Strike
• Unholy Aura
• Shadowbolt
• Death Pact
• Raise Dead

[Kem-bleeding-hollow]

Boss mechanics in Vanilla.