Help me understand SL hate

Your first mistake is assuming that the relatively miniscule number of people that use these forums are at all representative of the rest of the playerbase as a whole. We’re just the loudest ones, regardless of where we stand, and ironically, whether anyone else can even own up to it or not, it’s because we’re the ones who care the most.

For each of us expressing dissatisfaction over the game there are dozens, maybe even hundreds who just flat out stop playing without saying a word, and there are just as many (for now at least, I imagine) that are still playing the game without sparing a glance at these forums, whether they’re happy with SL or otherwise.

And it’s nice that you’re still enjoying the game, there’s nothing wrong with that. But a lot of us are not. If you haven’t played the game too much since mop, it isn’t hard to see why you would still like it. There’s still a novelty to it in your experiences that many of us who have been playing regularly all these years have long since lost, and that you’re playing with friends only enhances that.

For me, though? The game’s simply grown stale over the last three years or so. It’s become so repetitive, so uninspired. So needlessly frustrating. Even playing with friends, even being in a raiding guild, even getting CE and KSM every tier is no longer enough to keep me feeling those things. I could go into detail about my many gripes with the game, but I’m pretty sure it’s all repetition at this point. You must’ve heard it all before. Suffice it to say it makes sad to think about because I really love(d) this game, but I refuse to let myself be shackled to it out of a sense of obligation born out of sunk cost.

I’m moving on, at least for now. But before I do, I have to come here and express just how angry I am at the way things have gone for me, for my own peace of mine if nothing else. Maybe the game will get better and I’ll come back; history’s taught me not to hold my breath for that, though. We’ll see. FWIW, I hope you still have fun at least for a while longer, but I won’t be surprised if at some point the fun stops for you too.

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I do Torghast from time to time on a few toons, I think I have at least a 190 legendary on 3 alts. That was it for me. I burnt out faster on the Maw quests and dailies faster than Torghast but for similar reasons.

Fortunately I started late enough in the expansion that I have 40 renown on about 6 alts without really trying. For that alone I’m glad I didn’t start from launch.

And on this particular issue?

Nothing about legendaries feels… well, legendary. There’s really no effort involved in obtaining one and the systems around building them up feels like something that should be in place for every piece of gear.

The legendary cloak in MoP was a good experience to work on (outside of having to win a battleground, lol. I was alliance back then. RIP). The rings in WoD were a good experience to work on.

This feels like a bad version of wakening essences to me. Which were a collection system in place for the end of an expansion, not the beginning of one.

I liked Wakening Essences as a system, but I doubt I’d have liked it as a launch system. But at least it gave me a reason to do world content, too.

There needs to be something special about legendaries and there isn’t. Everyone has one, you can get it the first week you hit level 60, it’s like an Artifact weapon, but without all of the cool things that artifact weapons had going on, IMO.

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I started from launch so I do think you are ahead of the proverbial game there.Im dedicating this expansion to all the old content and seeing if I can get it all before the next expansion.

I loved SL initially…then I didnt. I dont hate it though its just stopped resonating.

Ill probably lvl class and race combinations that are appealing to me…like an undead warrior…I have idk like 6 warriors now…its stupid lol.

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If you’re asking if you’re wrong, then the answer is yes.

Yeah, I got my few toons to the “casual soft cap ilvl” of around 190-200 and now I am doing older content as well.

And a lot of fishing. I fortunately only started seriously messing with pet battles the last expansion or so, so I have all that content to work on as well.

I think I described you perfectly and you’re upset about it.

I realize I’m four days late, but I just want to re-quote this whole thing because it says it perfectly. Just hit the nail directly on the head, could not have said it better myself

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OP, I’m gonna play until WoW is gone, all my friends play it and as a roleplayer I’m interested in how to work myself into the story.

Also farming TMOG is fun.

Theres a saying , if you correct an idiot they will hate you, if you correct a wise man they will respect you

I feel like the problems i have with retail wow all stem from when it became retail wow. Cataclysm. I mean, these days, wow is just a completely different game from the first 3 clients.

Not that wow since then has been horrible or that i hate it, but just a ton of decisions i have not really agreed with. Not going to quit over it. I mean, we have wierd gear names and awkward stats. Like for example, what is the difference between a soldier’s blade of the aurora, and a soldier’s blade of the quickblade? I have no idea lol, and i do not know if the balde i mentioned is real or not, but of the aurora and of the quick blade, i was used to of the whale, of the bear, of the eagle, etc on stats.

Catalcysm destroyed the old overworld and revamped the old overworld as wel knew it, with no option at the time of really reliving the old overworld in any way. It really blew players like myself away, and quite frankly, since then it just messed up that curve that i had when leveling. I love the cataclysm revamp zones, but i could not appreciate them at the cost of the old zones. It was just frustrating to me. On top of this, tons of the old instances that were not revamped got changed drastically. Like compare wailing caverns from classic wow and classic bc to retail. An entire section is gone from the instance, and it just seems so shallow when leveling through nowadays. I realize popular opinion of that dungeon in particular was pretty low, but i guess i am one of the rare ones who liked that dungeon. I preffered the old unaltered version

Even to this day, world of warcraft has pretty much done away with all of the rpg aesthetics and tropes since cataclysm. I know i am one of the rare few, but buying ammo or arrows on my hunter made my hunter feel more like a hunter. Now arrows just come flying out of my pants. I just do not understand. Most people found it annoying. Did that mean we should get rid of it? idk. Since cataclysm, blizzard has fixed things that weren’t really broken to begin with. Arrows in wow, or bullets, were relatively cheap comparatively cheap to any other mmo i ever played. It was at least 100 gold or so in runescape for 1 single arrow. Variety of ways to create them yes, but way, way more expensive than it was in wow regardless of how you sliced it. That was a common complaint in wow was having to constantly have to restock.

In wrath, you could hold 1 k arrows in a single stack, so in my mind it wasn’t bad, but blizzard decided to remove ammo from vendors entirely. Heck i am still trying to track down arrows on my retail hunter, specifically the ones from icc in wrath in retail. If anyone has any, let me know, i will buy them. I still have my quiver of a thousand arrows stuffed with arrows lvling up in retail to this day, just to remind myself of that one mechanic.

I also have not been a big fan of homogenization of classes and junk, specifically when it came to ports. For example, at every given point in world of warcraft’s retail universe, there are like 15 npc mages with like 20 different portals and teleports opened up. Just makes the world smaller, and everyone essentially becomes a mage without actually needing to be one or roll one. I miss each class having those defining traits to them, only ones i can think of now are warlocks and rogues. No one else really has access to lock boxes lockpicking except for engineers for low lvl stuffs, and warlocks closets are still useful, as portals are not an option everywhere.

Being able to fly all over and mount all over whenever wherever, at lvl 10 and 30. I miss the levels being more restricted for stuff being unlocked and to create more progression. Level 40 for the longest time was required for a lvl 60 percent speed ground mount. Levels were the restriction back then, and gold. Now in shadowlands and a few expansions prior, you had to do these crazy achieves just to fly. Typically, i am not a huge fan of flying, especially in eastern kingdoms or kalimdor, or really any of the old zones. Like i always mount a ground mount in orgrimmar and thunderbluff, because these were old zones that lacked flying for so long.

Now there are a variety of ways that i use to get around progression. If i am flying to the barrens for example, if i wanted camp taurajo in retail, i just use vendetta point, because it is just north of where camp taurajo was in wrath and before. So i pretty much only use certain flight paths, and no matter what toon i am playing, i always make sure to discover them as well, including the city flight paths, which you no longer have to do. Or i do other things to recreate the progression curve, such as avoiding all the alternative routes to leveling, sich as pet battles and pvp exp, and gathering proffesion exp. I only do each dungeon twice. I had to get to lvl 20 to dual wield on my monk. Dual wield was locked behind a lvl 20 requirement back in the day and a trek to your class trainer, so i do that. OR my goblin shaman in legion reached lvl 40 before he could dual wield. Dual wield for shamans back in the day was locked behind 40 lvls in the enhancement tree.

When it comes to talent trees, people talk about how they were better, and more involved. But the only thing i miss and was the truly unique thing about them, was the ability to cross spec. Back then, it made more sense. For example, on a warrior in classic wow, try using rend on a rock elemental. You can spam it all you want, and all you will get is immune. OR try using a fire spell on anything made of fire. It is also immune. Makes sense. Cannot make rocks or air or whatever bleed. ANd you cannot hurt something made of fire with a fire spell. With the class design in shadowlands, so far i like what has been done. Getting frost shock and weapon enhancements actually made me feel like a shaman again. Nowadays when debating talents, that is som,ething i always bring up. I miss all spells being tied to the entire class itself, rather than most spells and abilities being tied to the specific spec. It gave a reason for a fire mage to have a few frost spells because otherwise, anything made of fire, you were screwed. I feel the retail game should have the same stuff back the way it was, but i mean we do not need all the immunities tied to certain spells back. But i should not be shoehorned into a specific set of abilities just because the others are for one spec.

Certain expansions like legion brought in new concepts like world quests, which are essentially glorified daily quests, so nothing really changed there. But in general, level scaling and zone scaling was brought about here, and while i am not huge on it, it ties into shadowlands, with the leveling revamp and chromie time. My major problem with shadowlands and chromie time personnaly, is just the fact that the original classic overworld was overlooked as far as adding the classic overworld and it’s accompanying dungeons to chromie time. Like, i think it would be hella cool running through the original barrens, the pre revamped barrens on my nightborne hunter if i wanted to. Or the original shadowfang keep, deadmines, scarlet monastery or whatever. Would have added a lost dynamic back into the game. Stuff like that really makes me wish i had at least had all of my toons to outlands before cataclysm came out. SO much stuff i cannot even snag anymore because of the revamp as well. Chromie time is cool, but seriously. No one thought of this. Would have been the coolest thing since sliced bread.

People bash shadowlands and earlier expansions for alot of stuff, but to be honest, it is just as repetitive as it always is at end game. Leveling is not nearly as involved as it once was. Lvling up is all run and gun, vs strategising mob take downs, and trying your best with your skill set up to survive. It is another thing i do not care for in modern wow, but like everything else, i try my best to recreate it. Torghast gets alot of hate. Just the trendy thing to hate on retail wow now. You have mythics and mythic plus 5 mans and raids, which essentialy the new modern wow heroics after cataclysm’s heroic fiasco. End game is end game, and i will have fun when i get there. Lovin the shadowlands zones so far and the lore.

In cataclysm and pandaria, well cataclysm specifally for phasing, i never was a fan of phasings introduction in the death knight starting area in wrath. It just further separates everyone within different areas. So you never really see anyone who is not in your phase layer. IDk. I just find it annoying at times. You have chromie time and warmode off or on, which adds like 7 different phases to possibly be in at any given moment, combined with each phase having an additional layer divided between who has warmode on or off. Like i never see people leveling up anymore because of this stuff.

Pandaria added cross realm zones, which inherently weren’t a bad thing. Problem with realm match making is just the fact that you cannot trade with anyone on the other realms most of the time. So you can only talk to them. Commerce is a huge deal in the game. WHen the garrison stuff was added in wod, it just attributed to heavy inflation loads due to a huge oversight with the jewel crafting follower trait, the gold mission table, and it just was really bad when we are talking about wod. Wod just had that, but also no content. Wod looked really cool if it had all that other stuff that was promised. I mentioned ammo up above, and wod was supposed to have a class accessory feature that would have been cool for hunters.

Shadowlands overall has been like every other expansion since cataclysm, but i definitely miss the old days of the way wow used to play and work. I am enjoying shadowlands so far, particularly the class design. The lore seems cool, so much they can do with it. Most of the changes over the years since cataclysm i just have not been a huge fan of. Or something like chromie time not having vanilla wow pre revamped zone leveling as an option for me. I have no problems trying out the new stuff, like torghast. Castle nathria looks really cool to me. Kind of has that kharazhan or shadowfang keep feeling to it.

My hate with shadowlands is how long it’s taking to get 9.1 out. All the hype from this expansion has completely died at this point

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It is partly because of the content issues, but mostly it’s just the casual negativity that permeates everything online. Star Wars, GoT, the latest Star Treks, Warcraft, some people online just want to look for things to throw hate on, they think it makes them look cool and intelligent when they do that

I hate the story. This “afterlife” feels horrible and nothing like an afterlife at all. It just feels like yet another alien world where everything works exactly the same as it does on Azeroth, including life and death.

Honestly, if it weren’t for my friends, it would probably be the end of WoW for me.

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For me, i have invested so much time into my toons since i started, and my pandaren monk and my goblin shaman I have had for like 4 years, but i recently in bfa and legion lvled them up a bit. Went oldschool on them. Discovered stuff, got to lvl 40 without a mount on both toons, only the 60 % speed one at lvl 40. LVl 20 for dual wield, etc. All the old tropes of wow.

I miss having random bullcorn chests spawn in the old overworlds as well, specifically the ones that dropped gold bars, and cheese and stuff, some green gear usually and briarthorn or whatever.

These days i use legion wardrobe system as a way of recreating progression in some way. Did shadowffang keep once and was able to transmog fenrus hide. Artificial restrictions.

AS far as shadowlands goes, it has not been to bad to me. I like the dark depressing lore, with a possible backstory for old villains and characters to spotlight. I just wish the patch cycle, was more involved. Hopefully we get a bunch of patches afer 9.1. Same thing as every expansion to be honest. Doing each dungeon twice etc. I only really do the 5 mans anyways, and never touch the raids. And i pvp.

expels air from nose

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Those are my biggest issues. The systems feel just so bad. We’re gonna get everything taken away at the end of the expansion and there’s gonna be catchup in the future patches so, it just feels pointless. Conduit energy is also a needless hindrance to gameplay and just feels bad. Hell, I’m not even personally bothered by it but the principal of it is awful. Covenants being tied to player power and the refusal to #Pulltheripcord as they said they could do is just baffling.

The aesthetic is more of a personal thing but yeah, it doesn’t 'feel Warcraft. Nothing is familiar and there’s little, if anything, drawing me into the Shadowlands. I also don’t like the idea of actually explaining the afterlife, I like there to be some mysteries in the game. And there’s still so much to explore on Azeroth, why the hell are we going to the afterlife?

They killed casual everything

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Hardly. Your first post wasn’t even directed at me. I just recognized it for the incredibly pompous post that it was. Describing everyone who has a problem with Shadowlands as people trying to fill a void in their life is quite a ridiculous leap in logic.

Nobody complaining about Shadowlands is doing so because of a void in their life. Good Lord, how melodramatic can someone be. lol

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