Would barely affect you if they did the same as they did with pvp by scaling M+ 13 ilvl down as it seems your main content is more M+ and that you aren’t pushing for CE or mythic.
Splitting them up would mainly remake mythic raids gear progression happen again in raids and you wouldn’t be overgearing heroic raids as much.
as someone who never raids I am totally okay with m+ being top tier heroic/entry lvl mythic gear instead of 489 myth track just so M raiding has some meaning still.
Ok well first off, I don’t run mythic by choice, I have the logs and m+ activity to get into near any group, I just choose not to because I like these guys I’ve been with the past decade.
Second, it would 100% affect me. I would have to farm all slot twice, enchant and gem twice of everything, decide what to craft with my limited choice, have to make a hard choice in the vault between each, have craptastic trinkets imposed on me, and I wouldn’t be able to carry my team as much as I am right now.
And third, if it’s fine because it apparently doesn’t affect me, well I don’t feel forced to m+ so by your logic, it shouldn’t change, no?
I’m just stating the the main changes would be for mythic raiding, and would make raiding gear from heroic more interesting vs m+ early on. This wasn’t a comment on you being “less or more hardcore”.
Enchants slots and etc. is not really a big concern. Your gear would still work for heroic raiding, it would just not be as good early on. You would just not be able to overgear heroic raids with M+ gear.
I don’t get why people would quit myself. The comment you’re responding to prove that people are only in M+ for the gear, otherwise they would be in favor of this change.
Edit: This entire M+ argument just intrigues me. I cannot understand why people are defending probably one of the most boring live-service systems that Blizzard has ever implemented into the game.
M+ only purpose is to extract time out of people, it reuses old content, so no new content is being made, and it forces more play time from players than we ever had in the past. The entire system just feels like it was created at the behest of the execs to just pad session play time.
It is crazy to me that modern MMO players have accepted this. I see this nonsense in the other big live-service games, and WoW is following suit with increased cosmetics and a bunch of boring, repetitive, cheap to make game systems to keep players engaged.
Yeah hows about you just keep ignoring me instead of using a middleman to indirectly respond to me.
And if people m+ just for gear, explain why so many 21+ keys are ran everyday.
Because they are a joke this season. I do not push and have timed +24s.
Ok what about previous season, and the previous? And the previous? This isn’t a trend just this season.
only 1200+ characters have pushed a key over +25 last season when the top keys when up to +30s
Ok, what about 21s and up? And 1200+, the + can literally mean any number above.
Imagine if these guys were kind of forced to do rated arena for their gear progression. You would see these forums explode. This is how it is for a lot of people that don’t like M+.
I would love to see forced participation in rated PVP for these M+ players.
PvP is a whole different genre with a whole different gear acquisition. And there was indeed complaining up the wazoo in Mists of Pandaria, when you were required to get 2 battleground victories for the legendary cloak.
And please stop indirectly responding to me. It’s annoying.
So is M+ lol
Because boring is subjective and they don’t find M+ boring?
No matter how you want to measure content, there was more delivered in Legion, BFA, and Shadowlands than any expansion prior, when M+ was introduced. There is no justification for expecting there would be more content if M+ were not in the game.
You mean like I had to run arenas in TBC because my guild did not see a tier helm token for druid drop in our first 19 Archimonde kills? Like I would have to again if no farmable gear source of season-appropriate item level existed as would happen if raid was the only option? Yeah no thank you.
Fight against npc monsters that drop loot that is pooled from its loot table. It’s same thing. Pvp you don’t even have to win to get something…
1180 exactly.
Not a metric easily obtainable and if you’re more than 5 level under the max M+ key you aren’t really pushing. Max keys in season 2 went up to +33s.
The comment to which you are responding was talking about running keys beyond the point of getting gear, not pushing score. Any key run above +20 isn’t being run for gear, it doesn’t matter how far from the season max that key is for demonstrating that point.
The thing is they are not, as keys keep dropping gear and can be used for your weekly box. If you aren’t pushing chances you are still farming your weekly box. It’s not because I do +24s that I am not doing them for gear. If I am running a geared group a +20 will melt and will be less fun at this point than doing a higher key because everything will die too quick. Running a +21 also is more safe with pugs and because more people will want to group up at level 20, so if it deplete with a pug it’s not too bad. The level of difficulty of keys is pretty important when looking at numbers.
You’re trying to move the goal posts here. As soon as you come up with any reason to run something beyond a +20, no matter what that reason is, there is no way to make the claim that group is only running M+ for gear. If gear was the only motivation, that group wouldn’t ever run anything above a +20. In fact, as soon as they get enough Aspect Crests to fully upgrade every item slot, they would cap their keys at +18.
You’re always saying I move the goalpost when I provide an argument.
It just gets funny for me at this point.
And there is no way to make the claim that they are not, unless they’re pushing for title.
The only way to prove that would be to remove anything over +20 from the great vault and remove any gear incentives from them. And I’m pretty sure that would have a massive effect on it.