Which MMO should they look to for guidance on how to build an MMO? One that has existed for a longer time and been more successful?
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Of course is not mandatory when you donât even clear heroic
They also really undertuned normal and heroic, heck I would say they also undertuned the first 6 bosses in mythic. It seems Blizzard hasnât grasped how to balance raids with crafting and the upgrade system in place.
Habbo Hotel
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Does that mean CE raid groups could potentially clear mythic without having to rely so heavily on farming M+? If itâs that much easier, then it shouldnât require so much gearing up first and raiders could tone down the M+ spam?
They could, it just takes a lot longer and the ce guilds dont want to just clear the raid, they want to do it as fast as possible.
My guild killed the first 3 bosses with an average of 465 ilv, less than heroic ilv, but by the next week we all jumped 10 ilvs and one of the biggest reason why is m+.
But M+ isnât a borrowed power grind in the way Heart of Azeroth Essences, Vision gear, and Choregast Legendaries were.
If you can get a +4 Strength +4 Stam Leather Belt from raid and from M+, there is no necessity to run M+ to get it, unless you want more chances to get it sooner.
But if you wanted a legendary item to use in M+ or raid or even WQs, you HAD to run Choregast.
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This is a loaded question with the sole intent to just troll.
Of course, because the premise of your post was stupid.
What did I say that was inaccurate?
Both make you grind them to be able to minmax. Both give you power. Both give you something mostly unobtainable in raiding. While they arent exactly the same they have more in common than not. Spamming islands for ap or m+ for gear is the same concept if your goal is raiding.
You could argue back then that you also get ap from clearing raids and that farming ap was a choice, people would laught at you the same as thinking that farming m+ is optional if you care about gearing and power, m+ is just so far ahead.
Mythic raiding which should reward progression and long term commitment is barely worth doing when I can be 486 right now without doing it and the cap is around 489.
Just the aspect crest issue completly unbalance the contents. Wich is why at minimum if m+ can drop aspects crests heroic raids should too. The great vault imbalance also should get adressed, capping 3 slots with m+ is not comparable to raids at all.
Clearing heroic in a pug is a challenge. I was happy we got 3 down with no wipes. Larodar was the stop. 2 wipes and as any pug, people drop.amd its over.
This simply isnât true and you know it, such at Iâm not even sure why youâre attempting to make this point.
If you donât do M+ now but do Mythic raid, youâll eventually get the gear you want.
But if you never did Choregast in SL but did Mythic raiding, you were NEVER going to get a legendary.
You cannot equate min-maxing a few item levels with the power / abilities granted by Essences, Vision gear, and legendaries.
Youre grossly overestimating the differences while not considering what makes them work like each others. If youre not willing to accept that they have a lot in common Im not willing to entertain you further as you disagree with the reality.
You completly ignored what I said and explained.
If you cant understand why I make the comparison then youre truly lost as it should be obvious that both share some of the same problems but only one got fixed
Go back and read it again
The main point is the grind. Borrowed power have changed designs a lot, the grind is why they got removed. The grind is why m+ share the same problem. The fact they gave you wings or made you look like a unicorn doesnt matter, if anything that was the good part
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But youâre missing the crux of my point, which is that if you DONâT grind M+, you will still get the gear you want, just at a slower pace, which was NOT the case in BfA and SL with Essences (as in, the actual Essences slotted into the necklace, not the AP for the necklace), Vision gear and Legendaries, which is why so many players got burned out.
The AP grind via Island Expeditions is a strawman; I never made any argument regarding AP farming. Grinding AP in Islands is not analogous to grinding Soul Ash in Choregast.
All those systems problem was the grind. I dont need to add more. Trying to be picky about the differences doesnt change that.
Thinking that you dont have to minmax to clear the content when they balance around it? Or that its a viable option when you can simply inspect most raiders and see that most of their gear come from m+. You need to be disconnected from a lot to think not doing m+ wont impact you way negatively. It might not be as strong as some borrowed powers were but the power gain is still very relevant.
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In 2023, World of Warcraft had 5.6 million active players, with over 870,000 active players in the Classic version. Thatâs a ratio of 6-1. One primary reason is that retail has mechanisms like M+ to keep dungeons relevant, while in Classic the dungeons are play once and done.
Then wouldnât a simple solution be to balance around NOT having M+ gear? Make it like I suggested much earlier: Tier N Mythic leads into Tier N+1 Mythic, unlike now, where Tier N Mythic seems to lead into Tier N+1 Heroic.
Either that, or we can exclusively wall off Mythic raids and M+ (i.e. M+ gear works in Normal and Heroic raids, and vice versa, but M+ gear does not work in Mythic raids, and vice versa).
I know earlier I said Iâd be fine with Blizzard walling off M+ and raids completely, and Iâd still be fine with that experiment, but having listened to some of the M+ and raid players, there is the very real possibility that players doing Normal and Heroic raids who are happily supplementing their gear via M+ would now find themselves facing a wall of frustration if they get stuck on a boss and cannot obtain supplemental gear from M+ to help progression, so Iâm not so sure this would be a viable alternativeâŚ
Then content becomes too easy and you get the emerald nightmare situation.
Walling of content has been a solution proposed.
I wouldnât do it unless they rework the UI for gear so bag spaces arenât concerned.
But like said before right now the biggest inequalities is for the aspect crests and the vault.
The upgrade system is supposed to address that issue. But if raiding loot is really too low then maybe they should also buff the amount of loot dropped. Iâve suggested before a 30-50% buff.
But only if you run M+. Since Mythic raid opens at the same time as all the other raids and M+, there isnât going to be weeks of farming M+ to gear up like there was for EN.
Itâs a possible solution but it goes against the RWF idea and the overtuning they do early on. It could work I just do not think that itâs a great solution as the problems it can cause can be more complex and lead to an unfulfilling experience in the raid for many more people.