For the purpose of clearing at all, it’s 2 day guilds only (Not the good ones, the less good ones). For the purpose of maintaining rank in order to attract applicants and maintain a healthy roster, it’s everyone.
Does the purpose matter? At the end of the day I think all CE raiders want to clear the raid as fast as possible, we all know we are clearing it, but we do what we do to clear it as fast as our guilds can.
At it seems the move is to extent sooner or later.
Honestly no, it doesn’t. It just wasn’t something I felt relevant when I was answering the question as I had understood it to be asking what would happen were extension no longer possible.
All guilds outside of those raiding extreme hours would be slowed down, likely by a lot, but it’s only those 2~ day guilds in the triple digits that would fail to get CE due to the additional time constraints and lack of consistency in reclears.
To be clear I’m not in favour of this idea, at all.
It’s weird to get raid gear and then the best way to upgrade it is to run dungeons.
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Not being able to extend would be a nightmare for everyone but the top of the top guilds, having to reclear a boss like Tindral just to get back for tries on Fryakk would put a lot of extra pressure and I’m sure there would be weeks we would lose 2 days by wiping on Tindral.
Is why I think it was funny when somebody said to just dont extend, is just silly to suggest that.
To upgrade your heroic/mythic gear you need to spam +16 that are easier than the last 2 bosses on normal. Makes perfect sense /s.
My end game is M+. I love that the gear is on par. It isn’t about the time you spend, but the difficulty of the content. I would hate to feel like I have to mythic raid just to push high keys.
Of course you love it - because M+ over-rewards. And then when you’re pushing over 20 it under-rewards. Clearing a 15 or 16 is quicker and easier than clearing the raid on normal or heroic, yet it is far more rewarding. So you are right about how it’s about the difficulty of the content - it’s too easy for the rewards it gives (up to a point). It frontloads all of the loot into the easy key levels <20 and then gives nothing past that.
Let’s not forget you don’t even have to time the key - the fundamental goal of an M+ dungeon - to be given the free super-inflated ilvl vault slot.
This really needs to be reiterated. It’s some of the worst game design ever.
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Again, people can discuss things here that you might not agree with. The fact that you’re telling me to quit, is just you not being able to handle someone criticizing something you enjoy.
So this comment here is a perfect example of what I’m talking about. Please just put me on ignore, because it is obvious you can’t handle having an adult converstation.
Playing alts in WoW was always a very popular activity, M+ and the borrowed power systems made this a lot harder.
Blizzard had a winning formula for over a decade, why they had to mess with that is beyond me.
The game just needed more content for players to do on off raid nights, slapping a timer on 5 mans and having them scale infinitely was bandaid fix at best.
Reading comprehension must be difficult. A shame.
I already said i was fine with arguing stupid arguments. Adds spice to life.
Again i was pointing out the inherent flaw that ones such as yourself make where you apparently never consider that instead of trying to get others to quit the game maybe you should yourself. And its stupid specifically because they arent self aware enough to at a minimum acknowledge that they are being childish and petty.
The fact you seem to keep ignoring that part and instead are biting your handkerchief tells me you either did notice this but are choosing to ignore it or you did realize it, took it super personal and just dodging it now to try and save face.
Either way is absolutely hilarious to me, so why would i put you on ignore when you provide me such entertainment. To paraphrase an arrogant anime king;
Please! Entertain me more!
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It’s not just that you’re criticizing M+, it’s that you’re calling for its removal AND dismissing anyone who likes the mode as the reason Blizzard has gotten lazy with content. There’s nothing wrong with you airing your grievances with M+ and its impact on other areas of the game, but it’s flat out hypocritical to act like you haven’t been telling people they should give up their favorite game mode when you are told the same.
My guild raids and does M+.
Why would one ruin the other?
I like variety.
I agree it should have stayed challenge mode. Or not, but had mount/ gear/ etc tuned for that style of game play. Its definitely NOT mandatory though. I have full cleared Amirdrassil several times on my paladin in normal mode and gotten through the first 3 bosses on heroic and i dont ever run mythics. TBH i have run a few, but i think my highest key is +3… so there’s no raid comparison coming from that.
I raid because i enjoy the game play but also the story of WoW. And usually you get that from storyline questing, dungeons and wrap ups in raids.
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Yep, and the gear should be normalized like in challenge mode.
The fact that barely anyone ran Challenge modes proves your point here about M+ being popular because of the easy rewards.
M+ is a loot piñata, this is the only reason people like it.
Speed running the same dungeons over and over again only has appeal to a small % of hardcore players. This is not good MMO content.
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To be fair, the loot that drops from 30 minutes of M+ is not equivalent to what drops after 5 hours of raiding. Each M+ drops 2 pieces. I think a better comparison would be one M+ dungeon = one raid boss.
There is no lockouts with M+, you can spam it to your eyes fall out if you want. Why the developers thought that this would be healthy for the game is beyond me.
M+ was the baby of Ion and the D3 developers that were brought onto the team at the end of WoD.
These people never worked on an MMO in their lives, so they don’t have a clue how to make fun MMO content or systems, hence the many borrowed power systems they have tried since Legion.
WoW needs new leadership, someone that understands what makes MMOs tick.
lol - yeah, because they obviously have no track record, which is why they went out of business 20 years ago.
This game would be much less popular without M+. Many of the most successful streamers for wow content focus on M+. I am a proud member of a wonderful raiding guild that has been active since vanilla, and we raid three nights a week. The rest of the week, we hang out in comms and help each other with M+. It’s what we do! We have fun together.
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Doubt it, WoW IP holds up pretty well. People over estimate the impact M+ has had on this game.
Classic is very popular, and doesn’t have M+.
Most of the Twitch content is not M+, it is Classic WoW.
Retail WoW does not have popular streamers. All the WoW streamers that have good followings are Classic streamers.
Ion was an encounter designer that was thrust into the lead developer role. People fail upwards in the corporate world all the time.
You do realize these two statements contradict one another right? The presence of anyone who likes running the game mode itself makes it impossible for the only reason for liking M+ is that it’s a loot piñata.
And that’s to say nothing about the impossibility of proving how large the demographic of people who like the game mode itself is.
Ion is the biggest stan for raid or die. The last expansion before M+ came into the game was the ultimate raid or die expansion was a massive flop. Isn’t it possible M+ was a reaction to the failure of WoD?
How popular is classic? I keep asking for numbers but nobody every responds.
Also, do we know how many classic players simply wouldn’t play WoW at all if retail were the only option? The popularity of classic doesn’t prove anything about the popularity of retail.
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What exactly do you mean by this? 