you didn’t count classic raiding didnt you?
It was part of the poll yeah. And? m+ still above.
Are we sure that they even think there’s a problem with how it’s done currently? Unless something changed as far as I know you can’t even begin to even do cross realm mythic gnarlroot until hall of fame is cleared right? Seems to be an indicator of how they feel on it imo.
Both are raiding and it shows that half the raiding population on the forum rather play classic than retail where… m+ exist.
Ok, and we know FOR SURE that the reason they’re raiding in Classic is because m+ exists in retail because…? why? Oh wait no, you do not know why they’re in classic. Could be a million reasons.
Because you can prove that most people like M+ when only 20% voted for it?
The poll wasn’t if you liked it or not, it was your preferred mode.
And I’m using the poll not like a hard fact just a show that raiding is split and that M+ doesn’t please everyone as much.
That’s not what the poll says though. You can’t extrapolate that people don’t like m+ if their preferred mode isn’t m+. Merely that it is the most popular preferred mode.
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M+ is not the favorite playstyle for everyone.
The poll said that.
You could rephrase it as “doesn’t please everyone as much”
No you could not, maybe someone prefers to do hardcore classic. Doesn’t mean they don’t like m+.
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Not liking something or liking it doesn’t mean you like it as much as the next person.
I don’t hate M+, but it is not my favorite playstyle and I know a lot of people enjoy it way more than I do.
Words he
That’s not radical
Puts away skateboard.
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You only gear from m+ now, raid gearing is completely meaningless outside of trinkets and unique weapons. M+ has ruined raiding.
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If by “ruined” you mean “obsoleted”, yes. Much like the smartphone did to the pocket calculator, address book, and land line.
In 2023, we play the game we pay for when we want to.
Raiding is a relic from a bygone era. It needs to evolve. More accessible. Smaller group size. Simpler mechanic reads.
In other words, you want loot for no effort. Basically what they did to m+ over the years.
No, that’s called “projection”. I’m a big fan of high difficulty, accessible content.
I’m not a fan of the middle management simulator that mythic raiding has become.
10 man mythic, no lockouts = raiding utopia
So the solution is incredibly simple then; don’t do that.
Problem solved.
There are extremely few people who are scrambling to raid to get more chances at early 4p or overpowered trinkets or higher ilvl gear or whatever else to push higher in M+; why should the opposite be any different? Some do, and that’s their fault and choice, but nobody is here complaining that they shouldn’t have to raid to do M+.
The argument seems to boil down to Blizzard balancing content around an ilvl that is more easily reached by spamming M+, but nobody said you have to clear the raid today, or this week, or even this month. If you CHOOSE to do that, that’s great; it should be your choice to play how you want. If you’re complaining we can’t go back to the dark ages where raiding was the lord on high and you can raid 2 nights a week and get the best gear, tough crap.
There is no part of the game that forces you to do M+ to raid. That is a social construct that you choose to engage in. It’s been around since 2016, 7 years ago. If you are still in a guild that socially enforces a rule that you don’t want to do, 7 years later, it’s time to move on. Make or join a group that matches your current expectations in the game.
Wow is not the game it was 8 years ago, and it never will be that game again. It absolutely should not be balanced around an extremely small subset of people of any kind, including but not limited to the top world first raiders, OR the next subset of raiders after that, or any other singular group.
Every suggestion or allusion on the topic thus far has forced implications on at least one subset of players equal or larger than the one it tries to help. For example, making M+ gear work only in M+ drastically punishes people who cross between multiple avenues by choice in the same fashion that PvP gear does currently. There is no perfect solution to this problem, so in reality everyone is arguing for their own position at the cost of someone else’s.
The difference is that the current system allows you to CHOOSE to opt in to the extra gear treadmill that didn’t previously exist, while locking gear to a specific content type FORCES you to commit to every gear type you want to access from the outset, meaning you definitionally cannot engage in each content type to the fullest extent even if you want to.
If you feel compelled to engage in M+ to raid, that is your problem that you need to solve, and is a problem that exists only in social expectation and not mechanically. The solution isn’t to make the game worse for everyone else. Every potential solution thus far does precisely that.
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It doesn’t punish you as what you got is an advantage before. Removing an advantage is not punishing people. When you nerf overpowered specs, it’s called balancing. And what a lot of people want is for M+ rewards to be balanced. There’s many ways to do that and buffing other specs or other content rewards so it can keep up with M+ would be a decent solution.
That seems fair. Playing the content you want to play and earning rewards from it? Doesn’t seem too bad.
You are “mechanicly” behind and have a worse experience if you do not do M+. It’s a lie to say there are no consequence or that it’s a “good choice”. My choice for me is to opt-out as that is the more responsible choice. People would rather not play the game than have a terrible experience in it.
It’s not a surprise that the need for Classic exploded after M+ kept being push to the front because a lot of people liked the “dark age” designs and still do, if retail wants to grow it need to reconcile with its base, the chase for new players hasn’t worked.
I think there are ways for M+ to coexist but gearing itself on retail is broken it is way too fast, balancing raids so they are better toward loot would be better but really what they need is to slow down gearing and if M+ can’t be slowed then splitting it is the better solution.