Guild Banks Pt. 14

WoW Classic WoW Classic General Discussion
792

“a huge part of vanilla’s guilds was trust and loyalty is everything. your gm or whoever would usually keep the guild’s items on an alt and you had to trust them.”

“i disagree giving everything you farmed to one guy to hold for the guild shows a great deal of trust. it not only promotes trust its puts in a position in the guild that is not really there in retail "the quartermaster"”

“Bag space is meant to be a resource in and of itself. If you give peoples bank-alts a bunch of low cost bag space in comparison to buying normal bags and what not then you will be influencing the market cost for bags. Which in vanilla high slot bags(the highest of which I believe was 18 slots) were fairly expensive, so reducing the cost to get high amounts of storage on a character would affect the overall economy. Guild banks weren’t introduced until patch 2.3, so it really has no right being in classic at this point.”

“My issue with guild banks is that inventory management is an important part of vanilla. Unlike retail we don’t have unlimited storage options.

I remember when guild banks were first introduced, I created a personal guild for my alts so I had near unlimited storage.”

“I never really saw guild banks as a blessing even in tbc? I think they came out before wrath I could be wrong.

For everyone managed well another 100 had items left to rot or funds unused. Every player should manage their own consumables and things like boes should be decided on within the group. If that means using it or selling it so be it.

I wouldn’t welcome back guild banks or perks regardless of the expansion to be honest.”

“Given the opposition to guild banks in every one of the previous threads, I would suspect that those who desire a truer classic experience would.

Those with an instant gratification, convenience oriented mindset and who favor the convenience of sharding would likely also favor the non vanilla QOL convenience of guild banks.“

“Here’s something new, though. Unless I am mistaken, Blizzard has already announced that they are using the vanilla mail system that takes an hour. They are doing that because they want Billy to actually have to make that journey to Johnny if he wants something that Johnny has NOW and doesn’t want to wait an hour.

How is that relevant, you ask? I’m glad you asked.

Billy is in Gadgetzan working on the Imperial plate Blacksmithing quests, and runs out of thorium. Billy turns to guild chat.

Billy: Does anyone have any thorium?

Johnny: Yes. I have about 6 stacks in my bank. Where are you?

Billy: Gadgetzan. I’m working on the Imperial plate quests.

Johnny: Gadgetzhan? I’m in Stormwind. I’m not going to travel all the way to Gadgetzan. I’ll drop them in the mail.

Billy: Don’t throw them in the mail. I don’t want to wait an hour.

Johnny: I’ll just throw it in that nice, non vanilla convenience called a guild bank, and you can grab it from there. Neither one of us has to travel and you don’t have to wait an hour.“

Some quick quotes from the discussion you clearly have not read and turned a blind eye to because it explains multiple aspects of why adding guild banks is a terrible idea.

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793

all of which were countered with logic and facts instead of emotionally driven nonsense.

“a huge part of vanilla’s guilds was trust and loyalty is everything. your gm or whoever would usually keep the guild’s items on an alt and you had to trust them.”
-guild banks don’t effect the act of trusting, they do effect the ability to fact check after the act of trust has been committed to determine if the trust was misplaced.
“i disagree giving everything you farmed to one guy to hold for the guild shows a great deal of trust. it not only promotes trust its puts in a position in the guild that is not really there in retail “the quartermaster””
-guild master has full access, guild banks don’t change that you have effectively ‘given’ the item to someone with the only difference being able to fact check if that person is worthy of that trust a bit bitter due to logs that cant be edited to lie.
“Bag space is meant to be a resource in and of itself. If you give peoples bank-alts a bunch of low cost bag space in comparison to buying normal bags and what not then you will be influencing the market cost for bags. Which in vanilla high slot bags(the highest of which I believe was 18 slots) were fairly expensive, so reducing the cost to get high amounts of storage on a character would affect the overall economy. Guild banks weren’t introduced until patch 2.3, so it really has no right being in classic at this point.”
-refer to my previous post, 300+ inventory room with 3 bank alts already trivialized inventory management, and that’s using the cheapest options possible for bags and no bank slots bought.

“My issue with guild banks is that inventory management is an important part of vanilla. Unlike retail we don’t have unlimited storage options.
-refer to above, also note, this person is stating an opinion, with no facts to back it up.
"I remember when guild banks were first introduced, I created a personal guild for my alts so I had near unlimited storage.”

-guild banks were introduced in late BC, which had A LOT more possible items, in vanilla inventory management was never an issue due to possible items per possible inventory room with bank alts. heck ill bring up a fact I didn’t directly mention earlier on inventory management. you could store 50+ items on YOUR MAIN’S mail box. so again, inventory management still not a core gameplay mechanic as it was trivialized day one.

“For everyone managed well another 100 had items left to rot or funds unused. Every player should manage their own consumables and things like boes should be decided on within the group. If that means using it or selling it so be it.”
-same can be said about guild bank alts, in fact guild bank alt owners would sell the items and keep the gold for themselves quite often, yet with guild banks you can help ensure that gold is used for the guilds benefit instead of someone paying it to Susie for real $$$.

"I wouldn’t welcome back guild banks or perks regardless of the expansion to be honest.”
-personal opinion, enough said.

“Given the opposition to guild banks in every one of the previous threads, I would suspect that those who desire a truer classic experience would.

Those with an instant gratification, convenience oriented mindset and who favor the convenience of sharding would likely also favor the non vanilla QOL convenience of guild banks.“
-I just laugh your using this as an ‘argument made against guild banks’ its already been pointed out its not about the QoL, sure im not going to say it doesn’t have some QoL, but that’s not one of the ‘benefits’ it brings that we are discussing because we don’t CARE about that that aspect of it, we care about the fact it helps improve security, scam prevention, community, CS workload, exc.

“Here’s something new, though. Unless I am mistaken, Blizzard has already announced that they are using the vanilla mail system that takes an hour. They are doing that because they want Billy to actually have to make that journey to Johnny if he wants something that Johnny has NOW and doesn’t want to wait an hour.

How is that relevant, you ask? I’m glad you asked.

Billy is in Gadgetzan working on the Imperial plate Blacksmithing quests, and runs out of thorium. Billy turns to guild chat.

Billy: Does anyone have any thorium?

Johnny: Yes. I have about 6 stacks in my bank. Where are you?

Billy: Gadgetzan. I’m working on the Imperial plate quests.

Johnny: Gadgetzhan? I’m in Stormwind. I’m not going to travel all the way to Gadgetzan. I’ll drop them in the mail.

Billy: Don’t throw them in the mail. I don’t want to wait an hour.

Johnny: I’ll just throw it in that nice, non vanilla convenience called a guild bank, and you can grab it from there. Neither one of us has to travel and you don’t have to wait an hour.“

  • blizzard is using that mail system because using that system vs the new one doesn’t have possible security, scam prevention, CS tickets, exc. issues that the new system fixes. also note, the same mail system trivializes inventory management regardless of system used. and guild banks don’t need to be everywhere in the world. to add them to classic they need to add a some type of trigger or npc with a trigger on them (not all that hard considering there is plenty of existing models and the triggers and coding are already there because they are working with the 7.35 client)
    and this can be done to one city per faction with almost no actual work time needed as its very simple to place an npc, add a trigger, and bamb the coding is already there from the client.

again, those arguments have been countered.

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794

I don’t see any of the arguments for guild banks to out pro the cons of them. I can only point out the negatives of adding guild banks so many times.

795

multiple of your quotes shows ‘inventory management’ as one of the issues, yet I clearly show how inventory management was already 100% trivialized in the form that guild banks could have an effect on.

being able to store 100+ items on a bank alt who has the cheapest bags possible already shows how trivialized inventory management was. guild banks don’t change it being trivialized, they offering better account security, scam prevention, community interaction within the guild, and improve the CS workload.

but hay, you’ll just ignore these facts, just like the last 100 times they were told in this thread chain.

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796

You’ll just ignore the facts set out in front of you, just like the last 100 times they were told in this thread chain. We don’t agree. Wait for TBC if you wont play without guild banks. Classic is not for you if you need QoL features.

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797

how original, repeat what I said with a few word changes is that all the argument you have left then? because all the others have been countered with logic and facts.

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798

Just how many stacks do you think people need access too?
-Each toon can already have 60+ stacks of storage,most people can have upto 8 alts.
-You can’t fill banks with BoP gear for stashing resistance sets/offsets.

So I honestly don’t see the problem and I wish people would stop spreading this “inventory management” trope as a reason against GB’s.The only toon it impacts is mains, but who honestly goes to raid with a bag full of greys and crafting matts if they’re in a pinch for bag space.

The rewards far outweigh the downsides. If someone wants to go out and farm 10k thorium ore to fill their Gbank then so be it, outside of some very niche situations thats money rotting in the bank.

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799

Seems Blizz does not share your view or they wouldn’t have banned people for the CoD scam.

We know. That is why we are asking for them.

I will say though. We have made a lot of progress from the first thread.
In the first thread the no changer wilfully ignorant argument was this isn’t a scam.

At least now some of you are admitting it.
Progress…

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802

This right here is another reason for guild banks.
I am pretty sure blizzard didnt give players all those character slots so they can only play one toon and use the rest for guild mats. I think they might actually want you to play different classes and on pve servers different factions. Crazy notion isnt it

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803

I love how people use “human/social interaction” as a reason against GBs, but completely and intentionally don’t mention mailing items to guild members if they’re offline.

So social…

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804

Actually, Blizzard gave us all of those character slots so that the first one could do all of the hard work, buy sigs and start a one character guild. Then, after acquiring sufficient wealth, starting alts and providing them with the resources to buy sigs so that they too could have their own guilds. Now inventory management is a thing of the past and complete economic self-sufficiency is practically assured all while living a life free of the fear of security holes because there’s nobody else in the guild to steal the loot.

805

Are you ignoring the fact that guild banks were added for the convenience that they bring?

806

IMO, this is an argument against guild banks.

IMO, the player should have to make the choice whether to give up characters slots for the extra storage space or use those slots for characters they will play at the cost of some extra storage space.

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807

You can fill those banks with non soulbound items to free space for those resistance/offets, though, can you not?

The “reward” is convenience and that reward comes at a cost of deviating from the goal of the project–namely to provide a product that is as close to vanilla as orcishly possible.

808

Guild banks are very convenient, but people still stole from guilds even with guild banks out there, some even created scam guilds for the sole purpose of getting easy gold people farmed themselves thanks to cash flow and guild banks holding gold.

Everyone will create a 1 man guild to hold their valuables and make it easier to hold merchandise to later sell on ah, might as well call it a merchant bank.

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809

On a personal level yes on a guild level no.
Which is why i have also wanted a high buy in price for the first tab. To dissuade individuals from gettjng and using a personal guild bank

810

IMO, that is not limited to a personal level, but should apply even on a guild level.

IMO, the player should also have to make the choice whether to use a character slot or two to help the guild, or to keep those slots available and not help the guild.

Blizzard bending over backwards so that players can have their cake and eat it too is one of the reasons why retail is in the condition it is in today, IMO.

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811

Even if you don’t use a single character slot for a bank alt, that’s 50X8 mail boxes which results in 400+ storage just from the mail system.

So again, inventory management inside of a town on non soulbound items was not a core gameplay mechanic.

Even ignoring character inventory slots you could have 400+ storage in the mail system.

This argument of inventory management being ruined by guild banks is a JOKE. Day one of vanilla wow inventory management was made irrelevant due to the work around that blizzard let happen.

Stop acting like inventory management inside of a town (the only place to access guild banks to begin with, let alone having to be in a major city that has more than just a mailbox).

Inventory management mattered when your out in the world or for soulbound items, but guild banks don’t change that in any way. So stop with this joke of an argument that guild banks ruin inventory management, because they don’t.

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812

You continue to argue convenience. And it continues to be irrelevant. Vanilla means Vanilla, warts and all. Good and the bad. Deal with it. We did once and we will again.

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813

100% in support of guild banks. The arguments that guild banks would change gameplay are laughably weak.

I’m extremely concerned with vanilla game play being changed, but the banking system is only game play in the way that character creation, logging in and out, and opening the current bank is game play.

Without guild banks you have alt mules banking and then you log in and out and trade. This is not game play and it’s a stupid system to force in the name of no changes. Guild banks make things more secure and will reduce GM work load.

The no guild bank, no change crying is arguing to preserve some bizarre minigame that most never interacted with as its the guild leaders and officers that played this game and most would likely agree that it adds nothing good or meaningful to the vanilla experience (slippery slope fallacies aside.

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