Group Finder Needs to Go

[Conrâd-aerie-peak]

who cares About talking?
I join dugon groups to gian xp and tring to die
if want talk goto genral chat other hter then that group finder is awsome

[Mátàlìn-stormrage]

One of the things I never see mentioned is that they should add an Azeroth wide chat channel. Part of the reason I don’t talk in trade is because I’m out in the world doing things. Don’t get me wrong I’ve had times were I’ve missed multiple dungeon ques to bs in trade but it would have been great if I could have continued the conversation while gaming. Right now its socialize (outside of guild discord) or game and I don’t pay $15 to talk to people, if I wanted to do that I’d join twitter or facebook.

That’s not really true. something as simple as severly slowing down leveling in an expansion would go a long way.

And we saw the MASSIVE amount of backlash when they did exactly that (and thats only increasing it a small amount compared to the months it took to get to 60 in classic.) Don’t get me wrong I make new toons all the time to go back and play old dungeons. But for most people leveling is a roadblock that stands in the way of what they want to do.

If you want to make leveling take longer turn off your xp and finish the zone there is no reason to force other players to play the way you enjoy.

I’m not demonizing anything. I’m advocating for separate servers that don’t have features like LFD. I think it has its place, but I want a version of the game without it. I think the people that are drawn to that type of game are people I’d enjoy spending time with. I’ll get that in Classic, but I see a lot of debate about what should be in the modern game.

So instead of saying X feature should be removed, I advocate for separate servers that have my desired feature set. It’s something Blizzard themselves discussed doing too, so it’s not far fetched.

I’m not against it per say, I would be worried about fracturing the player base into classic, rp pristine, pristine, rp retail and retail servers. Does wow have a large enough player base at this point to have a community for each of them. And where do we stop? Should there be a classic server with transmog and class tuning? If there was I might spend some time on it. Maybe we should split servers into normal heroic and mythic servers they all have the same ilvl drops but they increase in difficulty that way we can stop the casual vs elitist debates.

No it didnt. IF you formed your own group you could easily get groups together. I dont ever remember spending that much time waiting even as a DPS.

Your experiences certainly differed from mine. I remember routinely spending 2+ hours outside of deadlines looking for a tank, and on some occasions I would never find a group in a full 14 hour day of playing. Or having people quit and then having to hearth out spam lfm again and then fly back depending on the dungeon this could take an hour or more.

How much effort does being friendly and talking with a group of stranger for 20 minutes really take?

Depends on the person I guess not everyone is comfortable talking to strangers. Stranger danger and all of that.

You can claim that the group finder tool is too important to lose but you dont actually know that.

I can and do claim it because I would no longer be able to play alts as I usually play between 1am to 7am and there are very few people on at that time. I would become limited to my guild only for any group activities, which would suck because I do a lot of heroics and lfr.

So if you really hate people so much why not just make instant dungeons with 4 npcs or LFR with 24 npcs? That would greatly suit your needs.

Oh how I would love this. I could actually practice tank mechanics with a co tank npc that would actually taunt.

Mkdelta wants to make all dungeons and raids into max level content.

So time walking with all content available and always on. I would love this, personally I’m a bit tired of the limited dungeons that I have to spam repeatedly for mythic+, so bring on the mythic +10 Wailing Caverns. Though I wouldn’t mind a toggle to scale all old content including old quests to max level. Hell add a new loremaster achievement in there for incentive.

It’s the instant teleport that you want removed. Leave the group finder tool in. Delete the instant port. Suddenly you’ll find people will be a lot less toxic if they have to wait 10min for a replacement. It’s already happining in Classic beta. People waiting around for others strike up conversations etc.

Just want to point out that this doesn’t seem to happen for mythic+ so I’m not sure why it would for normals or heroics.

You remember those experiences. Do you remember the dungeons you ran in WoD or Legion or BFA? Prolly not. Do you even know what gear you’re wearing?

• A few but not many from classic.
• I remember quite a few from Legion not so much from WoD although again there were a few.
• Not at the moment but thats because I have multiple sets and change gear too frequently. This has less to do with community and the lfg then it does with the huge amount of upgrades available now and the fact that I already have several thousand peices of gear, names, maps, pets, mounts etc cluttering up my head. But I can tell you my pally who has not even hit max level this expansion (so havn’t played in 6+ months) is using the yellow tinted hidden version of the corrupted ashbringer.
• Is this surprising. You tend to remember unique experiences, if its your first raid your going to remember everything if its your 500th well you remember what boss took forever to get passed like mythic HFC’s Gorefiend were several people I knew had 400+ wipes on.

LFD, LFR, random bgs all these things are full of toxicity. If a player in LFD asks for help or where to go they just get kicked. No one even talks or thinks twice. LFD has created so much more toxicity it’s insane.

I’ve seen plenty of helpful people. Hell today I had a healer who told me what a great tank I was and wondered why I had signed up as dps, which incedently was the same group I asked if we should shroud and the rogue pulled instead on accident (no problems we still beat the +3 timer by a large margin anyway.) Or when dps didn’t know that all three totems in Atal’Dazar had to go down at the same time I just explained it calmly and we corrected it. Or when a tank didn’t know to pull runecarver sorn away from the crap she drops on the ground, me and the lock asked him to pull her out. No kicks or toxicity, in fact I can’t remember the last time I kicked someone who wasn’t DC’ed.

So the funny thing to me is this is actually an easier fix than it sounds. They’ve already written the code in the Overwatch code base. They in theory could port it over and have it apply a reputation score that could potentially exclude massively toxic people from groups.

Not a bad idea. The player gets a slider (1-10) to determine what reputations hes willing to deal with. Then you can score people at the end of content. If you can’t handle anyone but a perfect 10 then you have to wait a long time but if you are an a** to everyone you find it equally difficult to find groups.

It can’t be denied that we’ve pretty much stripped the game down to the point where there’s no point in joining a guild or being on a specific server outside of Mythic raiding.

So maybe its because of the guild I’m in but there are definitely reasons. First a mythic +10 with my guild is far easier then a mythic +3 pug. Second its nice to raid with the same people weekly, you get to know who is great at what and who is going to need a bit of help with mechanics. Third the community that is talked about exists inside guilds. The joking around, life gripping people to their death, portal roulette, misdirecting to our mage. Supporting each other with real life issues like when someone loses a big toe. You won’t find this anywhere but a guild were people have time enough to form real bonds.

[Vyndralx-malganis]

Never stated those other games weren’t truly multiplayer or not. I’m talking about WoW.

But your definition can apply to those games. What makes WoW’s matchmaking system so different from the matchmaking systems used in other multiplayer games?

What are you even arguing? Matchmaking in fps games has never been the optimal way to play. The best competitive experience is done through custom games or 3rd party matchmaking for the example of counter-strike. Matchmaking is the worst idea ever for a game based on strong communities and building friendships.

[Meritha-thrall (Meritha)]

Matchmaking in fps games has never been the optimal way to play.

I don’t think he was referring to FPS, but rather other MMORPGs. Are they also not multiplayer simply because they have an LFG tool?

[Vyndralx-malganis]

Matchmaking in fps games has never been the optimal way to play.

I don’t think he was referring to FPS, but rather other MMORPGs. Are they also not multiplayer simply because they have an LFG tool?

Who thinks mmos aren’t multiplayer?

[Meritha-thrall (Meritha)]

I am coming into this bit of conversation late, but based off Jalen/Rankin’s conversation, Jalen doesn’t think WoW is because of the LFG tool. If that’s all it takes, then no mmorpg is multiplayer.

edit: I could be missing something though, I admit I skimmed to catch up.

[Perel-stormrage]

Who thinks mmos aren’t multiplayer?

We can’t be mean on the forums so I’ll say ‘special people’ and leave it at that.

I think the problem is that WoW isn’t ‘multiplayer in the way I like’ from the OP.

[Vyndralx-malganis]

I am coming into this bit of conversation late, but based off Jalen/Rankin’s conversation, Jalen doesn’t think WoW is because of the LFG tool. If that’s all it takes, then no mmorpg is multiplayer.

edit: I could be missing something though, I admit I skimmed to catch up.

Here is the post before the other one.

This is a terrible point, how is your definition of multiplayer not narrow if you are putting 3 completely different genres through the same multiplayer tube? MMORPG’s have always been purposefully slower, and its to attract a different audience.

[Meritha-thrall (Meritha)]

Ahh, I missed that particular posts.

That said, they are all considered to be multiplayer, but I agree one genre has nothing to do with another. I thought the overall point they were arguing was WoW no longer being an MMO as a result of DF and that’s what I was addressing.

[Vyndralx-malganis]

Ahh, I missed that particular posts.

That said, they are all considered to be multiplayer, but I agree one genre has nothing to do with another. I thought the overall point they were arguing was WoW no longer being an MMO as a result of DF and that’s what I was addressing.

Yeah that rankin guy called jalens view of multiplayer narrow and then preceded to equate fps mobas and mmos into the same funnel.

[Carcharoth-kelthuzad]

I agree. LFR and AutoQ from the interface only fosters a behavior that depends on instant gratification. That’s similar to the problem of using social media. And each causes greater agony for people in game and IRL over time.

[Kreivos-area-52]

I had more time and I rerolled as a death knight to a bigger server on day one. I finally found a decent guild (after going through a couple of bad ones) but I managed to finally start seeing the raids.

Of course toward the latter end of WotLK my guild had some drama and I ended up leaving, and didn’t find another decent guild until around Dragon Soul in Cataclysm. So during that last part of WotLK and most of Cata, a lot of the content was denied to me but at least some of it was available thanks to LFG. It’s not always easy to find a group or guild that you can mesh with.

[Vyndralx-malganis]

I had more time and I rerolled as a death knight to a bigger server on day one. I finally found a decent guild (after going through a couple of bad ones) but I managed to finally start seeing the raids.

Of course toward the latter end of WotLK my guild had some drama and I ended up leaving, and didn’t find another decent guild until around Dragon Soul in Cataclysm. So during that last part of WotLK and most of Cata, a lot of the content was denied to me but at least some of it was available thanks to LFG. It’s not always easy to find a group or guild that you can mesh with.

It was kind of the same for me in bc as far as not finishing content. I didn’t get to see sunwell because i hit 70 way too late in the expansion to progress normally. We cleared up to kiljaedan but it doesnt count from the pre-patch coming out prior to wrath. I quit halfway through wrath when my guild was about finish totGC, it ate me up really bad that I wasn’t going to progress normally through a expansion before the devs destroyed linear gear progression.

It’s the main reason why I’m so excited for classic. I have way more time than i did during bc and wrath, so i can learn MT and finish a game/expansion release from blizzard start to finish finally.

[Taienna-aerie-peak (Taienna)]

LFR, LFR, LFM whatever is fine. All optional, don’t like them don’t use them. They aren’t negatively affecting my gameplay. You do you, I’ll do me.

[Valrayne-dalaran (Valrayne)]

Just want to point out that this doesn’t seem to happen for mythic+ so I’m not sure why it would for normals or heroics.

First off, M+ doesn’t lend itself to that kind of interaction due to the nature of M+. People are too busy obsessing over your io or dumping on you for using a non-meta class or spec to care about anything else. It’s also part of the reason why I think M+ should be deleted. It’s a part of the game that really does nothing other than fester very toxic behavior, in pugs especially.

As for everything below, I have experienced just such behavior. Sure Classic gets it more because Classic engenders that sort of interaction vs retail due to the nature of retail compared to classic. But its still there and the chances of such interactions happening are objectively greater in such a situation vs being insta-ported. Blizz also agrees with me since that’s one of Ion’s reasons behind keeping Mythics off the LFG tool from the video’s i’ve seen of him when he discusses it. It was on one of those regular interviews he does with that hobo looking guy on the official WoW youtube channel.

[Kreivos-area-52]

I want to be excited for Classic, and I likely will jump in on the first day it opens, but truth be told? I am scared. I am terrified at the possibility of having the same bad original Vanilla experience I had last time and I don’t know if I can take that a second time.

[Meritha-thrall (Meritha)]

Just remember that there are alternatives this time. Hurts nothing to give Classic a shot, if it’s not your cup of tea you can opt to not play it any more.

[Kreivos-area-52]

I mean, I want to give it a try. I want to be the good geared person with lots of friends this time around. I plan on going either mage or priest and I’d love to eventually be in T3 with an Atiesh. And I want to do what it takes to get there. I’m just worried about ending up as the scrubby green geared nobody warlock again.

[Meritha-thrall (Meritha)]

I’m just worried about ending up as the scrubby green geared nobody warlock again.

Aww, think positive!

[Waidmann-gilneas (Waidmann)]

You do realize with the lack of people playing now compared to the past , if Looking for group was removed and you could only get people from your own server the chances of you ever doing a dungeon or a raid goes down substantially.