One offs didnt affect the community as much as it dose now… their complaint is the only one i can kinda get behind with M+ complaints.
Sure we chainpulled and tried to get though quick in Heroics before M+ came out… but M+ and the popularity of streamers doing it, has made it so even a normal run while leveling up is now “take this shortcut, while i pull 6 packs” and rage quitters when their ‘plan’ fails
Before you at least tried to get gear most of the time before doing 3 pack chainpulls… now people think its how your supposed to do it… without using stuns, rolling defensives ect
In what way does looting it from the boss do this? Even with a mythic 0 you would only be able to loot the boss once a week, and then what? Leave the group?
Given the loot drought plaguing this expansion, particularly for players stuck in the desert of ilvl 170-199, and the over-reliance by the playerbase at large on raider.io scores for everything and anything, calling m+ optional is highly disingenuous.
IIRC the only thing Hardmode Mechagon had was a helmet, the Rank 4 from Hertz Locker and another achievement. Everything else was the same for simply doing Mechagon normally without the hardmodes. There was no reason to farm hardmode mechagon.
M0s in BfA were the same deal as now. The same deal as when Mythic dungeons were introduced in patch 6.2. The same thing as Heroic dungeons prior.
If you don’t do rated PvP, and you don’t do mplus, and you don’t raid past normal, why would you care about “keeping up” at all?
It’s a serious question, one that I wish more people asked themselves before whining about mplus. If you’re not doing content that requires high ilvl gear, what impact does not being able to access it, actually have?
what’s been taken away is the way you actually gear up and cap out. yeah all those dungeons still exist, but it’s not where you’d potentially find BiS like the old days. people are gonna do whatever it takes to get top gear- whether it’s from pvp, m+, or raiding. don’t think so? then why do people that hate m+ run them or buy carries, or pvpers run pve content in order to stay competitive?
my vietnam style flashbacks of healing an infinite number of heroic shattered halls to help key our entire raid team says your time miiight be a bit off there.
It was challenging enough at the appropriate gear level, compared to normal 5 man content, especially when it was new and everyone was learning. Certainly more challenging than a lot of M+ is - obviously not really high keys, but that difficulty is not mechanics, it’s “let’s add 1000% damage and hp and a few random affixes and call it good design”.
What most people are missing (which happens any time you criticise M+) is that I want 5 man, non timed content to be an alternate progression path too. Because I enjoy it more. Hence the torghast layered difficulty mode suggestion.
It’s not though. I do a lot of M+, and I have 3 pieces of gear on from the end of dungeon M+ loot. I am also sitting on 1100 conquest because I’m waiting for my weekly chest before I buy and upgrade a couple PvP pieces to 220ilvl. So tomorrow I will likely have 1 piece of M+ end of dungeon loot.
If you want better loot, your best bet is to PvP, get 1400 or 1600 and buy specific pieces to fill in your worst gear. M+ is definitely not an ideal way to raise your ilvl outside of the weekly.
M+ is fun, challenging, and rewarding when you can time the key, especially above 10. I don’t understand why people who can’t compete at a higher level want to take away something that those of us who can enjoy.
There’s so many options for you to go gear. you can do M0, then jump into CN normal and get gear that way, no problem, and that gear is likely better than what you’d be getting in keys half the time anyway.
I really don’t understand what you’re wanting them to “give back”. you still have your dungeons, but now there’s another layer on top for those of us that want to time keys.
Just because YOU don’t enjoy something doesn’t mean it should be taken away from people who do.
Well based on the 10000 whine threads in the forum at the moment about m+ not dropping enough gear, I’d throw that back at you and ask why you think M+ needs higher than 184 loot then?
… are you honestly asking why people want to experience character progression in an mmorpg? is this an actual question, or just a way for you to pat yourself on the back having reminded one of the plebs that they ‘only’ raid normal (because i cant get accepted to a heroic raid as a holy priest because the playerbase at large cant think beyond mythic metas) and therefore are undeserving of anything more?