If I raid I shouldn’t even have to do content like wqs, so it wouldn’t be shared content. And yes it’s totally fine that someone with better gear destroy content rewarding worse gear.
It’s all of that. And blizzard always was honest with raiding. They know players want gear when going into raids, the achievement is great but character progression, which is done with gear in wow mostly, is also a big reason to do harder content. The group experience is also great, which sadly feels diminished without master loot.
Carries are touchy subject, but they will always exist you can’t stop that. And that’s pretty much my opinion on them. Cosmetics I am pretty neutral about those, with BFA there’s an overwhelming amount of new mounts/pets/toys that I just don’t care too much about them.
Ilvl is simply a metric blizzard use to rate gear and since they can’t balance stats much it never meant anything much, which is why people asked for aotc or logs since forever and use raider io now.
I had a toon on another account with nice gear too, not as high as your gear, but it was great gear. I got it all from world quests, the island excursions, the emisary chests. I feel once reached a lvl with my gear, i lost the drive to even worry about flying in BFA. I do not know about you, but I think it should have come when we were able to do world quests. Nice job on your gear!
To entice people to do the content that most players who sign up for an MMO want to engage in.
I don’t think MOST people (except maybe modern WoW players) pick up an MMO because they want to single player everything.
The reason the group content has traditionally awarded the best gear in the game is because that’s what motivates people to form guilds and raid groups to try to get it.
Awarding Heroic raid level gear for doing solo only content undermines the entire CONCEPT of what an MMO is supposed to be so those of us who are looking to actually enjoy a multiplayer experience are increasingly having our experience degraded so that this weird group of players who want a solo MMO can have fun.
It’s like you won’t admit that a simple progression system makes sense.
You start from the bottom by leveling, then you do a couple wqs to get into heroic dungeons then mythic 0, from there you can start raiding or do m+. That’s the pve route. If you’re up there raiding, wqs rewards shouldn’t be attractive power-wise because you’re past them.
And why shouldn’t raiding offer the best rewards? It’s like your asking questions and are oblivious of the obvious answer, you get better gear to be able to kill harder challenges. Doing the same wqs, killing the same boars, picking the same flowers isn’t an harder challenge.
I’m not saying that there should be no gear obtainable from that kind of content, I’m more of a moderate. I think the balance between catchup gear and pleasing the “casuals” is a bit too much in their favor and it needs to go back to atleast Legion. The Legion gear rewards balance was already being stretched with titanforging but atleast it wasn’t rewarding heroic level of loot for wqs/world bosses and raids still had tier sets.
Why shouldn’t PVP offer the best rewards? Why does raiding get to be the ‘unique and special snowflake’? I was actually hoping someone was going to mention they ‘work harder’ that’s always one of my favorite arguments.
Here’s the thing I don’t care. It doesn’t affect my game play negatively or positively at any level to have someone else have a piece of gear that they were awarded for doing content they enjoy from a world quest, LFR, timewalking, world boss, etc. etc. It doesn’t change my teams progression on killing bosses, matter of fact it supplements it because they can get their gear from numerous sources, in some cases it helps the team more because if you find you need a second class/spec they can reroll and catch up.
End of day though, I don’t care. What you get in game as a drop doesn’t affect my game play. I still am off killing bosses and doing my thing. What the AH Guru, farmer, pet battler does during their time is fine and I PERSONALLY think they should be able to do the same SHARED content (which WQs are whether you like doing them or not) with the same ability to kill a boss. It’s not the gear that kills a raid boss, it’s the combined effort of 20 people.
Well I didn’t think we were gonna be talking about pvp, but if you insist.
I believe like lot of people that pvp and pve should be separated, pvp should get their pvp vendors and their gear should be better than pve gear in it. Either with things like resilience or pvp power or set bonus that only work in pvp.
Why must you try to make it sound like being a snowflake is bad. I never understand that with people. What’s wrong wanting to be different? Can you not handle the fact that a lot of people prefer to be unique than just a number in the system?
That’s great you don’t care because you can live in a rainbow world, with unicorns friends. Some people are more down to earth and actually care about what’s going around them. If you don’t care that’s like saying you actually cancel your vote.
Everyone is able to do all the content, you don’t need to sacrifice your firstborne or pay an extra fee to walk into a raid or a m+. If they don’t want to then there’s no point with them being able to get the same level of rewards.
And with Legion people have been able to reroll/gear themselves really quick with M+, why do you think wqs should matter for that Idk.
It’s actually both, try to kill a boss naked we will see what happen. Hehe
I’m just saying that an mmorpg should be based on progression. You can disagree, but at this point if you don’t believe in gear why even have gear in the game. Remove all gear rewards and let’s see what happen.
OK but Joe’s gear from doing other content doesn’t effect your gear in raid. The subject title is gearing is terrible and unrewarding and if it had stopped there I would have partially agreed, I am not 100% sold on the gearing system. The second part of the subject is ‘because of casuals’ and I still haven’t walked away with a great answer to why any other ‘player choice’ activity from PVP to Farming to Questing effects your gear at all. Why anybody cares what someone else gets in game? How it effects your game play? How does it effect your experience?
I’m not trying to say that the first post was exactly what I think. But I do believe in playing games that works in a fair way and respect some competitive integrity, which is why I dislike things like titanforging or pay2win.
It probly should. Its very high skill at high ranks.
Its the endgame.
Work harder than what? Wqs? Crafting? Leveling?
Raiding and M+ is objectively “harder” than those things. Thats why people say they worked harder.
This game has a sickness right now. Rewards for everything drastically reduces their value. Its instant gratification run amok.
Over rewarding players for any menial task also has the effect of reducing player engagement. The players that dont care about raids or m+ (nothing wrong with that) and just like to level and do wqs run into the ilvl wall far sooner.
It wasn’t bad luck, that dagger dropped multiple times, but you had 40 people in the raid, and every rogue and furry warrior wanted it. Well, rogues got first dibs, and even though it was BIS for Fury at the time he still had to wait. Then a new rogue comes, then another, then another. Have you ever had to gear 40 people and have a loot table that was set up those kinds of numbers? Perdition’s Blade had a 15% chance to drop and you were rolling against 10 people. Bonereaver’s Edge though was like 4 or 5%.
Just you wait till Paladins and other classes find out they are only taken to raid to heal and that’s it. Many classes while they had 3 specs only one was for raiding. Some others became viable with massive gear, like fury warriors, but they needed things like dual Death Bringers or things like that.
Why do mythic raiders need gear? Isn’t doing their mythic raid all the reward they need? Hell they need to be able to complete the raid without the gear in order to get the gear so they didn’t need the gear to complete the raid so why do they need to get better gear out of it?
You have undermined your own position by failing to realize how entitled your position is.
People want better gear for the same reason everyone else wants better gear. Having better stats makes you more powerful. Being more powerful makes the game more fun. People play the game to have fun hence people want better gear because that increases the fun they have.
Personally Jalen I invoke my right to refuse that claim! Whilst WoD was certainly better than recent “amalgamation and homogenization” of gear, it still suffered from forced scaling.
The system still heavily favoured PvE players in PvP (one of the reasons I imagine at the time you wouldn’t have noticed this downside to the system).
Ultimately any system that is unduly bias towards a group is flawed. The fact that PvP gear scaled down in the opposite content whilst PvE gear did not is a strike against the sustem.
Personally I would consider the best period somewhere during the PvP power/PvP resilience system.
The design separated PvE and PvP gear whilst still not providing an advantage to an individual side.
PvE players were disadvantaged in their gear in PvP whilst PvP players were disadvantaged using their gear in PvE.
I would say in order to feel successful, there must be failure. Not necessarily at the cost of others, but people need to lose. It builds character. It separates the hackers from the slackers. It gives meaning to the effort. Without loss there is no win.
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