I mean, I’m going to follow-up with myself on this one.
I have a 181 ret pally and with wings+DT I hit someone in arena with Final Verdict for 12k followed by an 8+k Wake of Ashes with a TV of 11k. That’s 31k damage in 3 button presses, not including the original DT damage.
at 181 ilvl.
i’ve been hit with condemn from warriors for 10k. A spammable ability. My hpal buddy got hit for some in the 15k range.
6k-7k KM Oblit? That needs to be weaved by a mediocre ability to get? Chill out bro that’s getting too crazy.
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It’s actually an easy fix, frost was gutted on beta. Revert the Oblit/MOTFW nerfs and make Frost Strike included in MOTFW, boom spec fixed. Mechanically it’s fine. Frost issues are base number tuning; not aura based and lots of melee unfriendly encounters.
Edit: Make Rime empower Howling Blast as it does now as well as Frost Strike, so you can choose to use Rime to Howling or use it on FS and a Rime FS will strike up to 5 targets.
Yeah, my freshly dinged 60 arms warrior is hitting 10k condemns at 174 ilvl in pve, 6-8k in PVP as well lol.
But nah, can’t have obliterate doing big crits, thats just crazy 
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That’s just WAY too powerful.
I say we nerf obliterate even more.
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Don’t give them ideas, you fool!
NERF DHs.
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Sorry, I thought this was the other thread 
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I remember when they gutted Frost and everybody was crying, and “some people” (not gonna mention any names) said, “Don’t worry. This is just prepatch and Frost gets 2 buffs while leveling. They will be great.” I said ok, I’ll wait and see.
Well it sucked, and needed buffs just like we all knew it would. So no we were not over reacting, it was that bad, and the sky was falling.
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I remember Biceps stated that he was not concerned about Frost’s viability after the intra spec tuning pass. I actually was. He said Frost is fine before this hotfix and the one before.
I am not sure what he means by “fine” at this point. I still am wondering if we’re on the same page.
I wouldn’t call a spec that is gatekept by people for picking a wrong spec, “fine”.
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Oh! I also remember when Unholy was also trash because dungeon boss fights were too short 
Good times.
Good times…
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dont listen to those people and do tweet ion n the devs that this still sucks
Bic needs to be fired from his position
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I really should start Twitter. I’ve heard of dramatic things about it but that’s one way to communicate with professional people.
I am selective of whom I listen to. Now that we’ve reached a conclusion that Frost indeed is behind and is rising after progression along with nice buffs after the raw numbers and data shown.
I wouldn’t go that far.
needs more than a slap on the wrist man
as for 3v3 monk trill is #1 now cant find mes anywhere
Panda Wraithwok frost DK is #12
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And I do understand that releasing the x pac right before most, if not all, of their lead devs took off on holiday vacation was problematic. But if they did not then it would have been just released now.
So I understand why tuning was slow, but Frost did not need those nerfs in the first place. If Oblit build was stronger than BOS, they could have just left that be the case and BOS would have been buffed slightly now to catch it up. Way more people would have been happy.
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But, apparently according to Ion a passive build should not overcome an active ability by design.
To which I’d just ask why not replace the other two with more active abilities fulfilling different roles from each other?
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Because it’s Frost’s turn to become the worst spec. :^)
I know…
I know…
But he’s the Director so…
Welcome to the World of Azeroth in an Expansion where we travel towards the realm of afterlife. Only to be one of the weaker classes as a class that’s deeply connected to the Shadowlands…
… naw, that’s throw that out of the window like they did with The Lich King.
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That is mes.
He dropped in rating because cdew & trill have been queueing more with samiyamzy (fire mage)
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Which shows how disconnected the devs are from how frost works. All 3 talents play the exact same way, use ability x (bos or pillar) and hammer out oblits around remorseless. BOS actually simplifies the rotation by removing frost strike. Point being, all 3 talents in that row are actually passive.
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