being peaceful doesnt make you weak, I am not the one saying the forsaken is nothing without the blight, you are. I mean if thats the forsaken for you thats fine. I personally would like every gripe that the factions have with each other to be resolved, the blight is one of those things obiviously, this means that the alliance would forsake all claims to lorderan they’d might have. The point is that every faction leaves each other alone, but the thing is, the horde commited genocide and that happen and if this peace is coming they need to show that they changed specially the forsaken cause to me, they are the only horde race that didnt repent for the sins commited this xpac
But what do you want from them?! It is genuinely amazing reading through your posts and thinking, man … if I went ham on all my pet peeves I have with the NEs … and demanded that they be changed to become for more convenient for my PC race and Faction … you’d hate those changes I suggested. But, you doing the same for the Forsaken, totally free game because “Blight is War Crimes in a setting where a druid can use plants to bury entire armies alive if he wanted”.
I want the Forsaken to become more stable and less hostile; but I genuinely think that can come from the right investment in this change of leadership and the breaking of the Sylvie cult of personality. I don’t need to shatter the Forsaken Racial Fantasy that Forsaken players have enjoyed for 15 years to achieve what I want for the race. All I want for them is a Leader who genuinely cares, and for them to truly become more compatible with at least the other Horde races. I want these things because I do genuinely enjoy many aspects of that Fantasy, even if I don’t intend to play it … and I realize that it doesn’t matter what you do to the Forsaken fantasy now; because if Blizz wants to unhinge them again at some point … they will unhinge them.
That goes the same for the Horde.
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Blight is war crimes cause blizzard said they are nothing more. and lol cult of sylvanas and the forsaken racial fantasy are literally hand and hand for the last 15 years, you really can say that the fantasy should be left alone and have it make sense, unless they get a new sylvanas. The fact that sylvanas didn’t care doesn’t change that they worshiped her and did horrific things cause of her. Lets be real if wow was a more fluid game and people would never complain about not being able to play with friends, sylvanas caring about the forsaken and when she flew away started a third faction totally could been on the table. You want them to be compatible with the horde you say that but you dont want them to change at all, not even a little even after bfa, after all the arguments of what is the true horde.
You know I really, really don’t like you.
I suddenly “feel” so much more justified setting your tree on fire.
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No, I just simply don’t think they would require much to become a race more compatible with the Horde races. That’s all there is to it.
- First, the “Alliance of Convenience” needs to die. It grew old ages ago, and became increasingly one sided in favor of the Forsaken. Besides, they no longer bring enough to the table to get away with that sort of nonsense anymore.
- Second, they need a leader who actually cares about their wellbeing as a people; but one that doesn’t trample all over their racial themes, aesthetics, and history to do it. Voss really could be developed into such a character if Blizz were to simply invest in a bit of personal growth in Shadowlands. She’s had a foundation for it for years.
- Third, they need to find a way of continuing their people that isn’t so outright confrontational. But … with the release of a recent cinematic, the means to actually do that has opened up; with the now Lich King-less Scourge in Northrend. They can get back to their roots and harvest as many parts and people as they need to maintain themselves from that endless army.
Boom! That’s all that would be really needed to make them into a race more compatible with the rest of the Horde; and one that is more admirable … while also not completely shattering their racial fantasy. They can still be edgy, apathetic, and dark humored … but they just dont have to be “as” antagonistic.
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what about honor? That part is missing and its literally what bfa was about so saurfang died for nothing?
Honor has always been subjective, and even Saurfang openly stated that he never achieved it in his life. Its an abstract to be pursued. Tauren conceptions of Honor are different from Troll honor; and Orc honor. As Our Father’s Before Us made that very apparent. So, the idea that the Forsaken become something with their own concept of honor … or at the very least become something that infringes less on the other Race’s conceptions of honor … is not a problem for me.
For example, them continuing to grow their population by getting back to their roots and freeing the minds of those scourge they can … would be a form of an honorable act in Forsaken terms. The Helm of Domination preventing such opportunities for so long is now no-more, so those opportunities for “honor” now exist.
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Thats not even close to what honor in bfa even mean, honor in bfa was about how the horde conducted itself towards the alliance, even the devs said this.
Saurfang did die for nothing. Most deaths are completely meaningless and serve no purpose.
Isn’t it great?
Laughs in Gutterspeak
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This is a story, death in story always means something specially in wow
Not really. 
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Well, Saurfang died in an attempt to pull a Movie Durotan against Gul’dan moment; to reveal to the Horde what Sylvanas really was and shatter her hold over them. Which, worked … so it wasn’t for nothing. It just could have so easily been for nothing if he wasn’t aware of a couple of her triggers. Hope and reminding her of her long history of repeated failure tend to be two of them.
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Figured that’s why it seemed so familiar and campy.
Like that smile he cracked when she blew her stack all because he scratched her precious little cheek and then Banner Bae/Flaggy Girl gave Sylvanas the “Oh, no the HELL you didn’t!” side glance.
I guess all the old fool wanted was to die and get his Horde back. He got his wish.
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Gratz on you for bringing up an element of the PTR that has been ditched.
As I pointed out in another thread, I guess the Kul Tiran doing it is alright tho :O.
Care to point out that so sophisticated plot armour. If it’s just jab, I’m tired of having Night Elves stuffs in almost every expansion (See! I can do it too!)
I like how you are blatantly ignorant, disingenous and dishonest. As if there was only 2 options : Full evil or peaceful. Choke on your false dilemma.
On the point of the Blight : Seems most folks kinda get their references mixed up.
As for Belmont : His horrendous role has been written out, never made it to the live server. Stop using this as an excuse.
As for Droite coming in here, knowing her perspective of the Horde he/she wants, I don’t think its should be hold up as reference on how to develop Forsakens.
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The death camps are in the game you know, they just arent called death camps anymore, but the forsaken are still using forced labor and working them to death
and lol what his role is the same, maybe you need to play more than just one faction
Even by wow standards, forsaken are messed up. It’s not like medieval people have zero standards either.
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That’s pretty debatable. I think the sort of things the actual Crusades got up to would give both the Scarlet Crusade and Forsaken pause.
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What? A stable, healthy Horde that actually makes sense to exist as a political entity? Rather than one that is so prone to infighting that it should have broken up ages ago? Or a Forsaken race who finally grows out of their Scourge-lite racial fantasy that increasingly came at the expense of every single other Horde race? Because … why the hell would anyone tolerate them if all they are going to be is unrepentant monsters that only reflect the atrocities they were spawned from?
All I want for the Forsaken is a leader who unambiguously gives a crap about them; the “Alliance of Convenience” they’ve maintained with the Horde to finally die, because they bring nothing to the table to keep them convenient for the Horde anymore; and for them to mellow out just enough to justify their continued existence. That’s all I think really needs to change. If you have issues with these three goals … not sure what sort of future you want for them?
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How’s it an alliance of convenience now? At this point the largest Forsaken populations are in Orgrimmar and Thunder Bluff. I think when a relationship gets to the point that they let you live in their homes indefinitely because yours exploded it’s moved beyond work acquaintance.
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Its not anymore.
The Forsaken bring so little to the table to keep an Alliance of Convenience convenient for the other party, if they don’t change in some way to become something that is more compatible to at least the other Horde races … the only thing protecting them is game mechanics.
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