Just a different type of echo chamber over there.
The only thing I know about the FFXIV community is how aggressively they advertise and demean people of other games.
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It’s pretty common for people on the FFXIV official forums to be critical of the game both in constructive and non-constructive ways - I think your experience of being “ripped to shreds” for your critique is more of a you problem rather than a reflection of the community.
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There is, though. Indisputably, there is. Unless you’re trolling, of course.
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This might not just be how the community acts but also the fact that tanking is just generally super easy. You’re a dps that doesn’t die basically. I loved my ffxiv paladin and it was by far a much easier time than wow is.(Not that wow is super hard). Mix that with all the content being linear and so pathing is never really a problem, tanking was a great way to level.
I think it’s silly to also suggest I just must not like story driven games just because I have criticisms with how the story is executed in one of them.
Especially for a MMO where I want to be able to go through the story with other players. At the very least, stop forcing solo quests when they really didn’t even need to be there. Even SWToR let me bring other players into my personal story instances, and that was very story-driven too.
but it’s also just a general gaming thing for people to conflate “I don’t like how this is executed here” with “I just don’t like games with this”.
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FF community acts like their game is perfect, unfortunately. They take criticism of it personally.
Most WoW players hate what our game has become and we desperately want it to be fixed, so we’re usually pretty critical and it’s gotten to the point where we actively expect the worst because it’s just happened so many times.
Duality of man, I suppose.
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Having played tanks in both games… it’s not that different in terms of difficult, at least for the content I stick to in both games (pretty damn casual for both). There is a grain of truth in calling tanks “Blue DPS” in FFXIV, but it really isn’t the deciding factor for the difficulty.
Encounter design is.
FFXIV and WoW structure their encounters very differently, with FFXIV often being called a coordinated dance while WoW is chaotic and messy. From a tank’s perspective, positioning the boss is effectively non-issue when the boss ignores what you’re doing the majority of the time as it’ll run to the center of the room and/or plant it’s feet for a big AoE.
Eh, I think that’s just more of WoW being messy while FFXIV can be very “clean”. I more or less gave up on group content in WoW with BfA (heck, only been back for a few weeks since leaving 4 years ago), but dungeons still felt linear in WoW… apart from some wider corridors with patrolling packs of mobs and some that could be skipped. FFXIV simply narrows the corridors and makes all the mob packs mandatory to progress.
In any case, the two games mostly felt similar in that respect. Still, I guess you could argue that FFXIV doesn’t inadvertently create some of the “shortcuts” tanks in WoW are expected to know.
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When I mention linear, I mean pathing to a great extent. There isn’t much room to really mess up pathing in ffxiv, but wow especially with m+ the pathing is very specific. And tanks have the added difficulty of knowing exactly which mobs they should pull without causing anger in the group.
Tanks in ff can just run in and pull, and generally are expected to pull everything in the dungeon eventually. In wow there’s usually half the dungeon that you’re not supposed to pull, adding to the possible stress of messing up.
In ff it’s basically impossible to lose aggro if you are stanced into it. Hitting something once will have it stuck to you forever. In wow it’s actually fairly easy to lose aggro on individual mobs especially on big pulls. Stuff like that.
I can’t be sure but I also think that dps might die easier. For some reason dps never seem to go ahead of the tank in ff. I played paladin and only paladin so I have no idea why this is different.
Edit-Or possibly come to think on it, there are many “walls” in ff. And tanks usually pull to the boss anyway. So maybe just designed differently.
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If it’s us vs them… My money’s on the WoW crew.
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FF14’s community is very cult like when it comes to criticisms of the game.
Isn’t that basically any community. That the ones likely to respond to a post are the more fervent ones.
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That’s another way of putting how I said it, though it does sound like it has become more prevalent in recent years. “Wall to wall” pulling is fairly common in FFXIV, as there is often a physical barrier that prevents progress until the 2-3 trash packs between them are all defeated.
So they’ve made aggro an issue again?
Or is it just some sort of damage drop-off with too many targets? That’s something I’ve seen in tooltips in WoW recently, which I don’t recall being present when I departed the game… though another detail of note is that WoW also is “messy” with a lot more mobs scattered around the board.
Another potential factor is that the difference between a top-end DPS in WoW and lower-end players has historically been MASSIVE. In FFXIV, the range is FAR smaller (add-ons may be banned, but people still do track damage output); there’s also stuff like lowering item level and character level to suit the content, so the gear gap tends to be much smaller.
Heck, they added in item level sync for the last trial of the Endwalker MSQ (6.0, not the patches) to make sure the fight wasn’t over too quickly.
I think that’s mostly common courtesy, and players simply are not rushing as much in FFXIV. It’s quite common for the party to wait out players watching cutscenes, after all.
As for DPS dying easier? It really isn’t that different, though I think “tankbusters” are more common in FFXIV; but those are almost never on trash mobs, and bosses rarely open with that ability (the raid-wide AoE is more common).
What may be more likely is just about every mob in the game having an AoE attack to move out of, and the tank having aggro keeps them all pointed in the right direction rather than go all over the place.
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Wow, this whole thread, except for a couple people, is bash FFXIV. That’s an answer right there on supposedly worst community.
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To be fair, people in the FFXIV community also bash WoW we just agree with them half the time.
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Never once got attacked for my ideas in the FF forums. What did you say? Not trying to blame you on this but really what can be complained about here and there are just different. If you push for WoW to be more like ff you will get clobbered here. The opposite is true there.
Not sure what that American thing has to do with it. The people on the forums there are likely American if you are on the NA forums so…not sure how you got that idea at all.
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It’s complicated but aggro has definitely become harder to maintain after a certain number of mobs. Something like 5 mobs you should absolutely not lose aggro. But after a certain amount it just seems like the tank is chasing them around trying desperately to hold on.
I realized this at the end of the post. I do think the boss-to-boss pulls are what keep the dps more or less from pulling ahead of the tank. And if a tank is not pulling to the boss, I think it sends a message to the dps that they might not be able to handle it. Usually instead of pulling, the healer will tell the tank they can speed up, if it’s just a nervous player.
Edit-a tank might also go slower if they see the little “new player” symbol above the healers head. Better to not show them the depths before they got their feat wet lol.
Not sure where you get the idea “people consider FFXIV better”. There was a protest that went on during Shadowlands but FFXIV is back down to around 1 million players . I don’t think the vast majority of people think FFXIV is better. Just based on sub numbers on Lucky Bancho versus what estimates are for WOW that have come out recently. Its not even close. People like to poop on Blizzard for all the controversies but WoW is still the market leader by a mile. I play both games but I literally only like FF for the story and once im done it I come straight back to WoW. There’s just nothing to do in that game. You are also correct the community imo is worse, the tribalism is insane. You cant give any constructive feedback or they come after you.
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In my time there I see it very rarely. Some of my discord people play both or say they are “WoW refugee’s” -lol!
The only reason I got more comfortable doing a dungeon (once in awhile) in WoW is because of the patience and kindness that boosted me up and supported me in FF. Everytime I get on after awhile (still haven’t finished story) I’m invited to that Novice thing. When I tried once I had mentors wanting to help so much I actually had to back out! lol
There is so much more kindness and patience in FF. They support their game - and yes, witch about some stuff changing or doing this or that, but not nearly as bad as the WoW community. I still like my WoW community, but running content is much easier in FF. I think it’s a given that most people know that so kinda much ado about nothing.
And of course, posting this on a WoW forum was naturally going to get a negative feedback to FF - blows my mind it’s not breaking CoC.
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Im sure plenty of people will argue all day about which game is “better”. But truth be told the games are just different. They both carry the title mmorpg but the actual games are worlds apart in design.
Wow focuses on the mmo and has the rpg as a side aspect. FF focuses on the rpg with the mmo as a side aspect. Or at least this is how I think of it.
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