there is no such thing as a PVP spec. UH DK, Fire mage, mutilate rogue, shadow priest, feral druid, balance druid, enhance, preg pal, aff lock, destro, survival hunter etc are all very strong PVE dps classes that also are gladiator level specs for PVP.
fury warrior has a few PVP talents as well, its just the worst pvp/class combo int he whole game so you never see it
wotlk was not designed w/ PVE and PVP specs. Every spec pretty much as pve/pvp talents. A lot of classes have multiple viable specs that are good for PVP.
bear weaving is a problem, causing a 20% buff (lolwut? just fix the weaving) but rend weaving and overpower weaving is fine
you have no logic, and Kris Zierhut specifically said they were not okay with a class being in warrior’s state of bringing 0-1 of a class to a raid. So youre just wrong.
Aggrend also said warriors would be kings in 252 gear, and warcraft logs still very clearly shows them at the bottom, only beating arms warriors (worst in the game) BM hunters, frost mages barely, etc.
UH DK, Aff locks, assassination rogues, elemental shamans, s priests, etc all PVP specs as well. Ele is pretty much #1 PVP spec in the game. UH DK sits at the top of PVE while also being as popular as arms at high brackets. Ele shamans outnumber arms warriors but quite a bit at higher ranks. Fury warriors have a bunch of PVP talents.
Cant figure out why this comment of yours is flat out wrong and debunked?
Where did the mean warrior touch you? Why you so salty that you take your time to advocate in bad faith and spread misinformation on a forum that almost no one reads because the mean warrior hurt your feelings?
They addressed that too. You’re welcome. Anyways if you need me to link their words more to prove you wrong let me know. It’s pretty easy to copy and paste
It has 0 bearing on now, this is a totally different expansion and more importantly you are acting like warriors kept others down, it was the lack of changes that kept others down, warriros would have been relieved if they didnt have to compete with 20 other players chasing their exact same items…
Agreed, different expansions are pretty much different games. The argument that a class was good in other versions of the game therefore should be made intentionally bad in this version is absurd. It’s like saying “Shadow priests are powerful in Retail so we should make them weak in Classic”.
According the WCL data it appears as though the majority of WoTLKC players either didn’t play the previous classic versions or played a different class if they did. So, the whole “you had your time” argument is a non sequitur.
Either the devs just accept the meta as it rolls out or they intervene to achieve greater balance, but intervening to artificially set a meta based on previous versions is a bonkers idea.
What worries me though, is that classic as a franchise is effectively fan service and thus popular opinion has some sway. The Warrior class is incredibly stigmatized and so it seems unlikely to me that any fan driven “balance” changes will work fairly in relation to the Warrior class. There is every likelihood that fan driven buffs will basically play Wrath out as some sort of player revenge fantasy.
I don’t think the Ret buff was out of order btw. But if Blizzard go further (as they did with Feral) it seems unlikely that Warriors would get a look in - even if they should. It just isn’t a popular class to buff. The whole idea of fan driven balance is pretty borked. Blizzard should be doing this by the numbers - and not the population numbers.
Lol poooooor warriors having to compete for loot. Never mind all the leather they stole from specs that had no choice like they did so they could obtain arbitrary gains.
And yes it is the reason everyone is mocking the 3-4 warriors asking for buffs. It’s why they look so pathetic and are embarrassing themselves on a daily basis trying to garner sympathy from a company that said they are more than happy with where they stand and a playerbase that has watched them be the most broken dps throughout classic. Nobody cares if you did or didn’t play warrior, the fact remains that they were out of line several times and never brought back to earth. But now that ret paladins went from last to last with buffs, NOW is the time changes need to happen for those poor little abused warriors lol.
They said that warriors usually start weak and scale into being strong. Pre patch for WotLK was the first time they weren’t the top parsing melee dps. They started vanilla and TBC as the best melee and played the duration of both as the best.
Buffs should be about fairness or equal none fairness like no changes.
All that went out when they multi nerfed warriors and refuse to buff em when they are the only class in the game that fit their description of being deserving of buffs to begin with, as the least played class in the game at that time and still is last i checked.
Whine at blizzard for optimizing leather pieces so god damn horribly, making leather ridiculously OP ? They could have fixed that as well by making warriors scale more on Armor and weighted AP on leather items differently, not giving all those leather wearers AP and AGI + other stats, while plate pieces had mostly only STR + other stats.
They never said they were and they are doing some things, such as fixing munching today.
No more broken than rogue was or mages/warlocks, in fact all of those specs were insanely dominant in most parts of classic and tbc as well and had several points they beat warriors especially in TBC. So your point as a rogue is rather lauhable.
Cause the game was forced to not do it cause of nochanges. Again not the warriors fault but blizzard.
Again you are like a kid screaming at the wrong person…
Or several of the other changes and feral that went from just better than warrior to 2-3rd best dps on some single target bosses and directly competes with what warriors bring in terms of buffs.
again kid like behavior. I suggest you find a therapist to help you with your anger towards all those warriors that must have taken your loot in the past.
Several times in fact.
They were miles behind several other dps in tbc at the start, rogues being one of them. More importantly they were lightyears behind hunters and warlocks until bis p2 gear and squawks + reck filtering and then in BT with glaives they finally started being nr 1 followed by rogues again ??
I dont know either but i can prove that you made it up
In the way that Warriors are pretty much hated in the Classic community. Many would rather see a Warrior nerf (even if we’re weak) than a buff.
“Should be” =/= “is”.
I’m not convinced fairness is a core objective of Blizzard at this point. I am keen to hear a Dev response to what heuristic they are applying to balance - if any.
In what way are they hated more so than “insert class here that has an advantage or preferable treatment over what X hater is currently playing”. Also i completely find peoples dislike or likability of a class irrelevant to the fairness of buffing or nerfing them.
I mean it seems to be what ever a dev is playing and then combine it with some arbitrary and demonstrably false justification. That was what it was clearly for paladin. Which is why they seem to have just been buffing and nerfing stuff and stopped justifying why.
warriors were known to be insanely op with loot prio on everything.
that attracts a certain type of people, aka trash.
Most ppl have had very disproportionately bad experiences with warriors. So, it’s probably true that most would rather see warriors nerfed. But buffs aren’t justified either way.
frost mages and sub rogues have a ton of CC, survive, and utility in those specs, while also having 2 other S+ tier specs to choose from. Arms does not have that luxury, so your point falls flat.
this is also just wrong
Aggrend said we’d be kings in Ulduar with the ilvl boost. It has been shown he was 100% wrong, so the entire premise has to change. It would make sense to leave warriors 35% below others in Naxx if they were 5% ahead of everyone in ICC. When the gap never closes, though, because we are on the ARmor Pen Nerfed patch, and a dev was ignorant of that, the point now fails.
Maybe you should have a look again, gruul single target, warriors are behind rogues, while this is inflated with logs utilizing recklessness a 30m CD and Chicken(chicken going both ways for the melee) either way all were behind several others even ret.
Only mag massive cleave at the start and Gruul cleave pushed warriors up in the tier over time, vastly different to what it was originally and even then at the very end of P1 as i showcase rogues still beat warriors on gruul that had a mechanic that gave em infinite rage via just standing in the debris puddles. So again, they were from lauch and into P1 worse than rogues.
Tout what, you are touting warriors, when i can showcase it being wrong until p2 mostly p3 ssc/tk with full bis. where they hit 4th 3rd best dps, where again rogues arent far behind, you can even try and look at all the single target fights 99% which outside of being screwed up with at the time (guaranteed 30% melee haste from chicken) pushed melees way higher than they were actually performing.
Known to who ? Warriors that had loot prio was the MT, called the MT prio, which happened to be a warrior in Classic.
Otherwise it is just best class/most benefit prio. Which has been a variety of classes including warriors.
yeah and now that trash is playing dks and rogues and warlocks, in TBC they were playing warlocks and hunters, then might have swapped to warrior in BT, but not many did as it still required you to get lucky with legendary drops to have that luxury big performance.
Most people have been ganked and killed by rogues and as an extent hate rogues far more than the warriors that was most likely tanking their leveling dungeons.
there are loads of experiences in wow and i doubt warriors being the most hated by everyone is the only or most prevalent one.
No cause they build the direct implementation of the arms set into the tier token, are you arguing that feral bear and feral cat isnt both specs in the game cause they share the same tier set ?
The tier for warrior clearly mentions arms only abilities like sudden death and mortal strike that is 40 points into the arms tree.
Exacty, aggrend made a tons of justifications, the problem is that everyone one of them was in disagreement with a previous statement they made or straight up just wrong like warrior scaling, especially since in original wrath the version of the game we are playing on was already nerfing armor pen, TG and shadowmourne warriors as a result of their scaling back then.
