Thats not what we’re discussing though.
Like you constantly creating strawmans for your own amusement?
We’ve admitted multiple times that Feral is in need of some tuning and attention. That was never the debate. But you know that
The only thing noticeable is that not a single feral has been able to come in here and prove that this “ noticeable” range has had any relevance to them and how they performed personally.
Even those playing at the top.
I just don’t think anyone is prepared to explain such a rudimentary concept as pole position to you. It’s such an obvious, fundamental concept. It’s like trying to argue with someone and they break out simulation theory or something. Your points make no sense because they’re not meant to.
They’re just mired in semantics until nothing has any meaning
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Just as this thread isnt prepared to understand the theory of relativity and how it pertains to the data used as evidence and being great examples of an explanation.
I understand most people have 0 common sense and would rather double down on being wrong than attempting to understand a new concept.
To each their own
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No?
Lets go back to OP.
(Since he started this mess)
My argument has always been that despite ferals “dead last” ranking on that pole. It has has little to no affect on his personal performance within his own group. The rankings of his peers are much more arbitrary.
case in point.
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/WdP8NXBM61qpJwRr#fight=14&type=damage-done
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/jT4NZhMb8fdR93pt#fight=19&type=damage-done
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/4WqNpTkvnhCfQtmZ#fight=3&type=damage-done
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/8MJA4rbWZxCvnkt6#fight=19&type=damage-done
Not “dead last”.
None of those rankings are equal.
Not one of you can provide a log where they are, as they dont exist.
TLDR: You’re dumb.
Thread was over after this comment.
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I don’t think that means what you think it means.
He is who he is. His skill is what it is. Aggregate data is aggregated for a reason: to paint a clearer picture than what can be seen in a single case.
Yes, someone 90% parsing on feral will be beating out all the 20%. There’s enough overlap between them that this is even likely. But the range is to the left of the other dps. They have a lower potential. So someone who 50%s their play will be doing less 50%-ing on feral than someone that 50%s on, for example, demo lock.
Which is the entire point of the thread.
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https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/9q4mLapFfkYKvgn8#fight=13&type=damage-done
How left is left in your stupid world of made up facts?
Oh but it is. And it’s pertinent to the discussion at hand. You not geing able to comprehend this due to not understanding relativity is why threads like this exist.
I’ll show you why, with your own words/examples.
Already admitted to this. Also, not what the discussion at hand is about.
And this is all based on relativity.
That rankings list is compiled into a format that will never exist in game. You will never find an entire group playing at the exact same.skill level (or even within the 4-5% range).
That rankings list can only survive under a singular circumstance. And thats that all DPS are playing at an equal skill level.
And since that does not happen, that list only exists on paper, and will not exist in practice.
It’s funny how you spew your discontent on here all day every day. Then someone challenges your methods and you twist it into some plea for help from the mods (oh, the personal attacks - lol). Imagine, a world where the great tical tries to paint anyone else as the source of negativity. Dude, this is laughable. You are a cancer on this forum.
Like I told your bully partner in his [I’m quitting thread] (which if it were real would be a catalyst for celebration around here), how about you educate people for real versus your faux attempts. You are negativity personified. You don’t prove your point. You seek only to discredit anyone that thinks differently from you. That is not how you win hearts and minds. That is how you troll an entire forum and mask your bully tactics.
If you don’t think feral is in a bad spot put something together like Babs did in the Monk forum and prove YOUR point, not discredit everyone else. The problem is, YOU CAN"T.
Oh yeah, btw, why don’t you read through this real careful like, you might learn something.
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Cant educate those who dont want to learn. You know the adage “you can lead a horse to water” ? Case and point.
Or just link logs from feral that show theyre doing fine?
This entire thread says otherwise.
Here I’ll show you something. Your own logs which are not very impressive, show the opposite of the point youre trying make.
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/my3KVXNGJQcP8gWT#fight=2&type=damage-done
There ya go. Not dead last. In fact youre doing considerably better than every other spec in there thats supposed to be miles and miles ahead of you, yet youre ahead of them.
How does that work when the rankings list is absolute and there isnt supposed to be any variance??
Oh thats right. Because of how the data is collected and compiled, it doesnt pertain to anyone in this thread.
Shocker
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It’s not a plea for help.
Oh honey…. No.
We’re laughing at you.
Stay mad.
Im still very curious where they got the idea to bring the mods in on this haha
If I have to spell it out for you,
see figure 3.
Assuming you’re actually confused and not just trolling harder than a lot lizard, See how the aggregate for the range of performance is left if basically everyone? That’s what they mean.
I can’t believe I’m saying this to another adult human being, but anecdotes are not data.
LOL … kid just posts links and puts random words in bold and thinks hes making an argument.
LMAO
skipped right past the disclaimer though…
Disclaimers and Source
The data for this article was taken from the Raid Statistics Page on Warcraft Logs for Mythic difficulty in the week of June 27th. We will be looking at data for the 95th percentile, plus showing the overall results to paint a better picture.
The idea of this article is to give a perspective of the current state of class balance for Dragonflight Season 2, meaning this is an incomplete picture of balance .We say perspective, as there are inherent biases in looking at the data this way.
Specs considered underpowered are generally played less and tend to appear weaker than they are.
This happens as many performance-oriented players tend to play the strongest spec or class, increasing the gap between top and bottom specs even further.
Position of specs for the 95th percentile might be skewed by alternative strategies and parse funneling. For that, we’re including the chart showing all percentiles’ results to paint a better picture for all specs.
Theres a lot to unpack there which explains why youre an idiot, but ill quote again the one line I want to beat over your head.
The idea of this article is to give a perspective of the current state of class balance
Thats it. thats all it for.
Its to show where the top performers of every class ranks relative to each other for any given fight or the raid as a whole. It can use used as a means to gauge your own performance against others, or against other classes, provided they are also playing equally.
They arent.
Case in point.
You.
You run with grey parsers.
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/z9yWmNnVd8RLTcCZ#fight=17&type=damage-done
That list has nothing to do with you.
You know what I see in that link you ignorantly hold as gospel?..
It shows that while the relatively close gap between classes does place feral at the bottom, that bottom is still more than adequate for any guild seeking a good reliable player.
case in point…
literally every log iv posted in this thread showing the crybaby ferals at the top of their runs.
bOo hOo , mY sPeC iSnT aT tHe ToP
… so what?
you are.
Feral druids are bad. It’s why I play Guardian.
I hate to be that guy, but I just want to point out maybe you’re not understanding the issue because you don’t do content where 20k dps +/- really matters at all.
If they’re the best player on their raid and they’re top of their personal charts, they’d still be doing 20k more dps as another class. That’s not a negligible amount. Playing a spec with a such lower potential is trolling in a world where it takes a week to gear up, or even worse in the Druids case because the superior spec is a talent change away.
If they feel strongly about playing a feral, that 20k dps they’re missing is always going to hang over their head. That’s a tax on having fun. You’re willingly giving up 20k dps to play feral.
You and your contrarian agenda are just transparent.
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ASSUMING that they play that other spec equally well.
Thats what youre all arguing. That Feral will do 20k dps less than someone else…
ASSUMING they play equally well.
But the reality is: feral players are doing better than their peers. Meaning:
Isn’t on the Ferals shoulders. Other players need to step up their abilities. If we take your logs
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/z9yWmNnVd8RLTcCZ#fight=3&type=damage-done
And compare it with the OPs
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/1fDqHpg9wkZjYcvb#fight=1&type=damage-done
You have 10 players that need to get better before the OP becomes the weak link and needs to peform better. So youre not doing content where 20k dps matters either.
Again, your argument is based off of assumptions. As is the aggregated data that youre trying to use to back yourself up.
Until you’re playing where every DPS player is playing at the same skill level, your argument is null and void.
Sure, you could do more as a guild if you swapped that Feral for a warrior. Know what else would help the guild? The grey and green and blue parsers doing better. Regardless of their class.
Take the player, not the spec
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Says the white knights who are advocating that we fix feral by just having them play with worse players so they’re higher up on the details meter.
Anecdotes are not data.
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Yeah, I’ve seen Tical on lots of posts. I’m not sure why they act personally attacked when people mention that Feral is garbotier this time around.
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We’ve never suggested such a thing. We never said Feral doesnt need attention ('weve also both advocated for buffs for the spec).
We’re just saying that the rankings list doesnt pertain to anyone until theyre able to play amongst a set of equal skilled peers ('and thats not even happening in HoF guilds)
Youre right. Data is data. The logs we use, are the same logs that is compiled into that rankings list. You cant say blue is irrelevant when youre discussing the color green
Because you lack comprehension. No one has said anything against the fact that Feral is lower ranked. Simply that where they sit in a rankings list is irrelevant to them when theyre upper half amongst their peers