Feign Death + Trap Bug

[Inviris-herod]

So happy about this - thanks for working on it!

[Sif-skeram]

Great. Sounds like I can hop on my hunter again in that case.

[Velara-gilneas (Velara)]

Should have been caught in beta.

But happy if it is fixed…at least they are looking into it.

[Doomc-bigglesworth]

The OP complains about feign+trap keeping him in combat after testing it 20x, which is a non-issue for me. If I test it 20x in a duel 19-20 of those times my trap goes off as predicted. So there is a discrepency between what I am doing and what he is doing, that can easily be fixed by reading/applying my post.

Moreover, I have talked to a few hunters in-game about this who were having OPs issue and I found that their macros weren’t set-up correctly, so no, not everyone has known that for 15 years. Simply throwing in /petfollow anywhere won’t work, it needs to be structured properly, as I posted. Some people are also confused thinking their pet being attacked is the thing putting them in combat which is misinformation muddying up bug reports.

The second point is that feign+trap consistency is a separate issue than feign death not mirroring vanilla functionality. The latter isn’t necessary for the former.

Now, the recent blue post fixes the hitting bug (which may seem big) but THAT bug is seldom the reason you’re put back in combat. The main issue in all of this imo is feign death wait period being tied to GCD, which as I stated earlier, has little effect on feign+trap consistency when your macro is set properly.

[Gromravager-skeram]

i guess you all need to tell me thank you
this is how you get update from blizzard
so much drama to fix a minor bug compare to fix layering make so much more damage to the game , also everyone know how range are able to shoot across wall and little Mountain , this look more a major issue to me , but funny any hunter and caster complain about this lol

[Hg-incendius]

still having issues with feign working, almost got me killed on princess a couple mins ago. but thanks for the update, hope its fixed soon.

[Treckles-herod]

It can still be resisted.

[Bandwe-skeram]

The fact that you don’t need to sit on the floor waiting for combat to drop post-fix is also huge.

[Pazorax-1880 (Pazorax)]

We are talking within the Spell Batching Time frame most def.

Yes, the message queue I was referring to is Spell Batching, so the delay is less than a second.

FWIW, Spell Batching exists in modern WoW as well. The only difference is the frequency of the batch processing. In modern WoW the batches are processed so frequently that its extremely difficult to have 2 opposing effects occur in the same batch. WoW Classic, on the other hand, processes batches just a few times per second, which is significantly less frequent than modern WoW, but still a fairly quick delay from a human perspective.

So the delay you’re seeing should be less than a second, and indeed our 1.12 reference has the same short delay.

I hope that clarifies things!

[Doomc-bigglesworth]

It’s not really one bug. It’s a few small bugs, like the hitting bug, turning bug, etc. that contribute to failure count, which are easily avoidable once you’re aware of them. Also, people need to realize that the time it takes for you to leave combat is very consistent. So you always need to wait the same amount of time (which is the time it takes for gcd to refresh).

It’s not a cure all of course, but your traps will become much much more consistent until the bugs are fixed.

[Sîxx-incendius]

Pazorax,

I would like to mention that I still believe there is an issue of when combat is dropped. Not sure if you’ve looked into this yet, but when you drop combat on live and from the beta, there was one “batch” between aura application and actually dropping combat. In all vanilla videos I’ve watched, combat was dropped as soon as you gained the aura, not one batch after applying feign death.

I can see how the issue you described was inconsistent, but the trap delays I’ve specially seen have nothing to do with being hit and are related to the time it takes to drop combat compared to vanilla. I hope that can be looked at moving forward, but hopefully this does help make it more consistent. Will have to try it out today.

[Sarouk-thalnos]

What’s actually kind of crazy, that players could tell by “feel” that this minor sequencing was off. And they were right.

Great job on the fix!

[anon98746708]

So if I understand this correctly:
Press pet button X
Pet button X enters batch
Pet executes X at batch time
Ability X enters batch
Ability X executes at batch time

Shouldn’t it be:
Press pet button X
Pet ability X enters batch
Ability X executes at batch time

Is this why when I hit Spell Lock it is delayed almost a full second? I used to ride enemy casts until the last moment, especially for long casts to waste their time then hit SL and have it silence the target near instantly in Vanilla all the time. I was absolutely nutty about knowing model animations, spell colors, sounds, etc to get timings right.

Classic doesn’t feel anywhere near as quick when I hit SL and now am forced to SL early to make sure I land before the cast finishes. It’s hit or miss. Sometimes it’s about a half second and other times it’s over a full second for the pet to react, making sure he has no GCD active at the time (I keep tainted blood off) and he has no other abilities to use other than auto attack.

Earlier today my Succ was lazy beginning a cast of Seduction while not actively engaged in combat, no GCD on her bar, etc. She also took about a full second to START casting after using the ability - just a few hours ago.

Watching the GCD spiral it’s almost finished when the cast would start.

Surely the pet lagging behind that much isn’t “Vanilla”.

[Snoree-bigglesworth]

Brilliant work. Thank you guys so much for your hard work :]

[Sicknot-sulfuras]

Keep making threads until it’s fixed, QQ as we hunters did!

[Huntarded-arugal]

hope this fixes the issue, at this point seems like batching is causing more issues than its worth why not just reduce the batch window to 50ms so theres less issues like this?

[Mayhap-arcanite-reaper]

Hey everybody, I wanted to take a minute to talk about Feign Death. Hunters are understandably very concerned about the behavior of such an iconic ability, with a variety of important uses, and I want to assure you that we’re aware of your reports and we’re investigating. This one isn’t easy at all. In our reference builds, many of the same behaviors that players are reporting do occur, but sometimes with slight differences in timing or consistency, which makes it really difficult to even identify a clear bug in the first place. However, despite this difficulty we have made some progress here.

OMG YAY A BLUE RESPONSE!!!

The first issue is that Feign Death cancels when you move, including if you turn, and very often high-skill hunters are running from an opponent, turning to shoot behind them, and then Feign Death to drop a trap. It some of these cases, Feign Death is failing because the spell-cancel on turning is more sensitive in WoW Classic than it was in 1.12. We’ve tracked down why it’s more sensitive, and we’re testing a change now that relaxes the spell cancellation to make it less likely that you’ll inadvertently trigger this if you’re trying to stop turning to cast Feign Death. That said, if you continue turning after the cast, or keep turning during the cast, you can still cause Feign Death to be cancelled. This fix will go out soon as a hotfix.

well ok, I mean that is part of the issue, but not the main complaint, but sure.

There are other reports about it taking too long to drop combat, or having combat re-activated because your pet is getting attacked, and we’re still looking at those issues. We’re tracking a couple of leads there, but we haven’t got this bug in our sights yet, so it may take a bit more time to figure out what’s really going on here.

other reports, these were the majority of them that I saw…and you dont have them in your sights as in, you dont know the cause, or you are just not prioritizing them over other things yet? confused here

I’m sorry it’s not a silver bullet, but hopefully it gives you some peace of mind to know we’re listening, and still investigating the issues.

appreciate the response, I really do but given how long it took for one, I don’t have much faith in you, so only peace of mind is currently “hey they acknowledged its a thing” and that’s it. Guess we will see how things go, as it is, once I hit 60 on my hunter, going to roll an alt and rush it up, if fd bug not fixed by time that one is 60, the hunter becomes the alt lol.

[Letter-stalagg]

Let us know if this change helped at all, and we’ll keep checking to make sure there aren’t any other edge cases we missed.

Unfortunately, if I’m being honest, I have to say that the change doesn’t feel like it really did anything.

I’ve been testing out here in Swamp of Sorrows for a couple of hours now and Feign Death is still not functioning like it did in 1.12.

I have several screenshots taken about 15 minutes ago of FD+Trap not working with a Pet involved.

Arcane Shot
Pet Attacks Mob
Pet Passive/Pet Follow
FD
No Trap

Even when I used Dash with a slowed mob, it doesn’t work. The Pet was a full 30 yards away from the mob, with my character feigned on the ground, I still can’t use a trap.

Okay, so interactions with FD+Trap and a Pet are buggy - Let’s try it without a pet. Somehow more disheartening, it does work but there is about a 2 second delay before I can drop a trap.

Arcane Shot
FD
[1+ seconds]
Trap

This is definitely not how it functioned in 1.12. There are several videos from 05-06 circulating online that demonstrate a smooth, uninterrupted FD+Trap combination.

My gut feeling says that Leave-Combat/Drop-Target functioned independently of the queue system. This would allow a player to instantly queue a Trap after casting Feign Death.

Thanks for adding some clarification, unfortunately we still have a long way to go.
Keep up the good work!

[Huntarded-arugal]

zzz i hope your wrong how is this still an issue?

[Zindan-bloodsail-buccaneers]

I’ll be testing feign death more tomorrow to see how this goes.

I just want to add as a player this is how I wished it worked.

1. Meet criteria to feign death (standing still etc)
2. Use Feign Death
3. Animation starts to play
4. It drops threat, combat, and goes on CD
5. If I immediately move then I slightly animation slide along the ground before standing
6. If I immediately trap I slide animation kneeling before standing
7. Some combination of the above animations to signify the player, in pvp, did something

I’m not asking for FD to be unresistable. I just want it to WORK in nearly all cases. Sure keep having camera/character turning (right mouse button) break feign death, but at least have it drop threat/combat as expected.