False reporting and automated ban

OK, I have energy for yet another large post. Sorry <3

Also, having these links at the top and bottom, of this post, for easy access ('cause people aren’t citing things):

Agreement

CoC

Mind you, we still have evidence of the abuse via Retail (or even the forums). It’s called being precognitive.

In regards to the CS Forums, unless a Forum Mod moves it there ('cause they move Classic specified threads from GD over here), I say this thread is fine where it’s at. You can use Report Fingers to report it for “being in the wrong place”, if you wish, but that’s not going to silence (ironically) the thread itself. So unless you have something else besides “go post cs”, you really have no other business posting in this thread.

You’re just being spammy ('cause you’re repeating the same thing over and over again), at this point which is way more reportable than one single thread, “in the wrong spot”.

If you’ve been paying any attention to my posts, besides the points you don’t like, you’ll know I’m against Blacklisting, too.

However, those being Blacklisted aren’t being neglected their right to speech. THAT’S the difference.

Also, we all (to some degree, anyway), “blacklist”, in our own way. Particularly the Ignore list. Doesn’t it not “Blacklist”? Regardless, I’m still against PUBLIC Blacklists. Personal ones, who cares?

Not everyone is an “expert”, in WoW. I still meet new people, every day. And not everyone may know that Skull is the “main target”. This is why we communicate.

Yes, people still love their “big numbers”, although I’m not one of them.

Again, how can one access a stranger’s Guild, Party and/or Raid without accessing the General, Local and/or Trade Chat Channels? Does being Silenced (this includes Squelch) have access to Whispers? If not, therein lies the problem. Players are being hindered to even join in groups (this includes guilds and raids) because a handful of people silenced (squelched) them, DUH!

Again, I’m trying to tell my story, but people like you are too busy covering your ears and demanding I (and others) post on the CS Forums, about it. I’m, at the very least, in the RIGHT thread, instead of elsewhere (spamming about it), talking about an issue, that’s important, to me, and how it may (or may not) affect Classic. All I care about, is preserving Classic which is why I’m mainly here, in the Clasdic Forums.

Well, the answers I got, prove that. I asked to be SURE, and it’s just as I expected, but you’re too busy picking on me, to take notice. Which is fine. Your spamming helps keeps this thread active so keep posting.

Or you’re trying to derail it 'cause you have no prauble cause to take down this thread, otherwise :thinking:

Anything is possible, really.

What do you mean by “freshly made avatars”? I have an idea on what you mean, but only you can clarify what you mean :thinking:

I’d love to explain my story (I said part of it, I’m just afraid to repeat one word because people don’t care about context but controlled speech) instead of fighting about where I should be posting it, and how I should be posting it :unamused:

Again, IK this (in regards to people may or may not be getting punished). What I am saying, they’re not being AUTO-punished like those getting Squelched. There’s deductive reasoning as to why I came to this conclusion.

As I said earlier, I have HUNCHES (keyword), on who my Reporters MIGHT be (again, don’t know, just deductive reasonings), yet they’re still posting around :thinking:

It can go either way. You said it yourself. I could be wrong or right. Either one is a possibility.

Alright, I guess we need clarification 'cause one person (not just me) expressed that it’s 24 Hours, while you say it’s an hour, but you don’t sound confident in that, either. So I don’t understand why you’re even trying to “refute” a point, you don’t know about. Unless you’re really THAT interested in fighting with me :thinking:

Again, are abusers being AUTO-punished? If not, than neither should the ones being Squelched Guilty OR Innocent.

Take out the AUTO, and we’re good. Keeps things fair and just.

Again, even if Abusers are being “punished”, it’s NOT automated. What makes you think that they are being AUTOmatically punished? Curious how you came to that conclusion :thinking:

That’s your Authoritarian side speaking. There’s nothing in the Agreement that states “only talk of ‘Trade’ is allowed in ‘Trade Chat’.” You’re hiding behind the word “Spam” to try to justify silencing those who you feel aren’t utilizing the Chat Channels, “appropriately”, at least to YOUR standards, give me a break :unamused:

“Spam” is to send the same message, repeatedly. Well, those actually utilizing “Trade Chat” for Trade Goods still fall under that category because they have to repeat their messages :thinking:

I guess that’s why we have an option to leave it 'cause it can get annoying, right? However, they’re utilizing the Channel to reach a broader audience, aren’t they?

And that Auto-Spam filter is a deterrent, to slow down the messages, including the “Trade Goods” messages. Again, if you leave that Chat Channel, you’re not bothered by “spam” messages. I’d see your point, if somebody was whispering you with their nonsense, but they aren’t. You’re just trying play Authoritarian.

Evidence: Your “suggestion” to have this thread in CS instead of Classic 'cause you believe it to be a CS issue instead of taking into account the POSSIBLE (keyword) issues, it can have in Classic.

Just like GBanks, Loot Trading, Sharding, etc. Why is this any different? Report and move on, if you’re that bothered.

Those Channels can be used, by anyone, unless Blizz has a rule stating which Channel can have what speech, you have no argument other than “but muh feelings!”

Again, EXPLAIN how I’m lying? You like to cut out small pieces of my speech and eliminate my explanations to fit into your narrative. I already explained why I think it’s bad. When I say “bad”, I don’t mean there’s an INFLUX issue, I mean I don’t agree with an AUTOmated system (which you still have yet to explain WHY it’s a good thing). I’m not saying y’all should lose your ability to Report :thinking:

I’m not in GD, just in Classic and responding to a thread, that brought up the issue. If anything, there doesn’t need to be 20 of these Threads regarding the same issue. Hence why I’m only responding to the ONE, THIS one, since it’s older and has more responses, DUH!

And you’re trying to preach about NOT spamming, yet here you are telling me to SPAM. Ridiculous!

I can still tell my side of the story despite your intimidation tactics and help give a voice to other innocent players afraid to share their stories. You don’t control me nor ever will. Do your reporting and move on.

Otherwise, we can talk about the stories and find a solution.

I linked the Agreement, earlier, as well, talking to Aehl about Blizz can only terminate your account, if it VIOLATES the Agreement. Aehl was trying to say Blizz can terminate our accounts, at any time, but that’s not true.

I’ll link it, again 'cause the agreement still plays a factor and coincides with the CoC: https://www.blizzard.com/en-us/legal/2c72a35c-bf1b-4ae6-99ec-80624e1b429c/blizzard-end-user-license-agreement

I’ll link the CoC, as well, since you didn’t do it (probably because you’re a fan of leaving out things, that hurts your cause): https://us.battle.net/support/en/article/42673

Anyhoot, we also agree to NOT disrupt/harass especially through “FALSE Reports” (in the means to INTENTIONALLY silence them!), don’t forget to read that part. AND the part about Blizz’s decision. You can report things, but that doesn’t mean you should be reporting to intend to silence them, and that decision is still in Blizz’s court.

You still CANNOT harass people with Reports, and it’s part of the Agreement!

Even though I already knew people were reporting on their own biases and interpretations, yet I got told I should read the policy, when I clearly did.

People seem to forget that you cannot harass others either, which I find numerous reports to be a form of harassment :thinking:

Oh, and this thread IS for Reporting. Making the situation known, right? Lemme guess “CS Forums!” We’ve established that, but anything else?

Thus lies my issue. Acceptable behavior IS a gray area 'cause people want to silence me for something I have ZERO idea on what needed to be silenced, in the first place. I said this from the VERY beginning :unamused:

Hence why I believe people are FALSELY reporting because their intention isn’t to protect Blizz Policy. The intention is to SILENCE making it a FALSE report.

And this is in your precious CoC, that you so cleverly brought up. Perhaps you should give it another read.

Just because it can be overturned doesn’t make it right because it’s clear as day that those reporting are doing so with the intention to SILENCE someone which is AGAINST the CoC, itself!

I NEVER said that it affects groups. I said it hinders one’s account! DIFFERENCE!

And if others are talking about that, you should seek your answers, from them. NOT me because those words NEVER came from my posts. I cannot tell you why they’re saying those things, so please don’t include me on THAT part of the conversation, I have ZERO involvement with.

And IDK what “Alt Brigading is”. I came here, to respond to a thread, that shares my same issues. I did NOT create the thread. I only responded to it. I’ll continue to respond it, even if it gets moved over to CS. I do NOT want to spam, the forums (in general, as a whole) with duplicate Threads talking about the same thing. Especially since this one is still highly active and one of the originals (or THE original, IDK which one is first).

Calm down, relax.

Exactly because it can go EITHER way! Nobody really knows. I have guesses, AGAIN, I would NEVER advocate others to join me.

Didn’t you just provide a highlight on “Behavior”, in regards to the CoC about how it’s up to the player’s to report on what they deem “improper” behavior? They have no real evidence either, except their feelings. So, it’s OK for them to report but not me?

You’re a hypocrite. Twisting things around to follow a certain narrative. Just stop lying and tell the truth. I’ve been honest this whole time. I even said, I don’t report often. Not as much as, Aehl, anyway. Who apparently reports FREQUENTLY. Curious how much “proof”, he has to justify his reports :unamused:

Again, you didn’t read EVERYTHING I said. You only cherry picked, what irritated you and left out my context.

Let me be VERY clear. I understand Blizz DOES punish people. But there are more subtle affairs, like this one, where some people, not in cahoots with each other, abusing the report feature intending to control speech (SILENCE), and there’s a few of you, here. This falls under 2 categories: False Reporting AND harassment which are both against the policy, that y’all agreed to.

I’m open minded enough to know it goes BOTH ways.

I hope you are 'cause you’re spamming nonsense.

It has, humorously. We can stop spamming it, now.

But you cannot report people for the intention to silence them. That’s in the CoC! And you sir, are breaking Blizz Policy with your FREQUENT False Reports 'cause you admitted your intentions are to SILENCE them making your reports unjustified!

Although, I already knew that :slight_smile:

No, you haven’t been patient. You cower away and only talk to me, when you think you found a “loophole” (like your false reports).

I’m not kicking nor screaming like a child about the Policies. I’m proving my point.

Also, look how much the game has changed, that everyone has “agreed”, to.

With PvP Servers now being obsolete, thanks to all the wonderful thread “suggestions”, for lack of better words.

There’s nothing wrong with suggesting. No matter how much you scream “Policy” (which you admit to breaking, yourself).

I think I rest my case :slight_smile:

Also, having these links at the top and bottom, of this post, for easy access ('cause people aren’t citing things):

Agreement

CoC

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Then there should be no justification to right click report for 'spam", correct?

no i said the most I heard was up to 24 hours

Mellga Crits and wins.
I didnt even read the whole post but if she is going through that much effort she wins in my book.

At this point, I don’t even really care how long it is. The only part I care about is that it’s AUTOmated. Yet, people want to pick at the nonsensical things :unamused:

Well, you should read the whole thing. It has a lot of things we can learn from it.

This is something I’m very passionate about. I said that I will fight the good fight, and I’m keeping my word.

I haven’t received one VALID reason why an automated system is a good idea.

It’s been non-stop back and forth cherry picking, for the sake of arguing -_-

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Is this some kind of Minority Report reference? All I’ve seen are fresh forum avatars claiming they have been falsely squelched.
Sorry that is not much in way of evidence. Especially when their stories sound shaky.

On the contrary I want you guys to take this to CS and be as loud and full of misinformation as some have been here. You miss my reasoning behind this.

CS is known for calling players out on claims of innocence but not being quite forth coming with all the facts.
Same thing is being displayed in this thread. From wild claims it’s going to impact world firsts to world bosses and everything in between.
A blue post has been linked showing exactly what you can do while squelched.
It doesn’t affect half of what is being claimed.
So by all means keep it here and continue arguing from an uninformed perspective of how it even works or it will work in classic.
Blizz still hasn’t said boo.
I haven’t reported this at all or anyone in here. It’s absolutely hilarious watching you guys be manipulated by uninformed streamers and being uninformed how it even works yourselves.
This is why blizz does not listen to feedback. Right here and we only have ourselves to blame.

Yes I spammed facts into two threads of spam. Threads filled with the same things being said from an uninformed POV.

You have a right to speech in America depending on your environment. Azeroth is blizz’s world and I didn’t see free speech listed in the coc but I did see quite a bit of language that clearly spelled out acceptable and unacceptable behavior.

As evident by people speaking out against things they clearly don’t understand.

And because of hiw the system actually works when squelched you can tell the rare complete noob noob what they mean:

Yes we do but apparently that is lost cause logic and actual facts be damned…
That comment you replied to here is asking how can this crap be believed if no one knows how it even works? That is also why I searched for the link posted above.
Because like I’ve been saying this is based on heresy with no actual facts. People are flat out misconstruing how the system even works so until we get better understanding(which I provided and literally invalidates most of this mularky) of how the system works people shouldn’t be running with this.

No one knows and blizz ain’t saying. So how do you determine how true the claims of 9 day old fresh forum avatar faces are?
Again. They avoid CS because those claims will be scrutinized.

What has you getting automatic punishment for false ban out of anything in that quote? Lol ya you lost me on this one.

No that’s my reading comprehension side that says one is for merchants and actual ingame business transactions and the other is for general communications. It’s in the context clues. I mean definitions. Lol

No I’m literally telling you that you can no longer repeatedly spam thunderfury endlessly because the game will stop you after like 2 in 5 secs. The more you know…
Not sure what’s authoritarian about that but ok if you say so. Lol
Also the only spammers I report are real money traders selling gold. So yea nice try at projecting there.

Just wanted to correct something to avoid confusion.

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OK I’ll shoot. One valid reason. Blizzard already has this method in place. Financially you’re asking them to make a decision they feel already works. If the player base makes it too hard on them they will say screw it and scrap it. Activision does not have the loyalty to their player base that Bill Ropers Blizzard did. Im sorry, thats the truth. Second, They do not have the manforce to do constant moderation across all servers. Asking them to take on employees after they have been trying to eliminate employees is asking them to reverse a financial decision thats been made. Again, make it cost more, activision will tell us to kick rocks and we wont get classic at al.

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Ask blizz. I didn’t design it. I’m just an end user man.

I missed this in your mega post. It is literally a customer service system manned by customer service reps. You don’t get much more customer service than this is.

No I want these folks claiming they have been abused to take it to CS because CS has been known for calling persistently misrepresenting players out on their innaccurate claims of innocence.

Ofc they won’t. That will kill the narrative of rampant abuse…

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If people are in your raid, you dont type /say or /yell…
so again people will not “Spam report” tanks in an attempt to cause the raid to wipe on the boss…

also again you still proved you didnt know how the system worked because you said "And it doesn’t need to be trolling. You can say cheating. Why did 20 people report a guild’s tank who was doing Kazzak? “Well, it looked like he was hacking and teleporting around.” Which has nothing to do with silencing.

Can those 20 reports for “hacking” still cause an auto squelch?

If your answer if “no”, please substantiate that answer with an official Blizzard statement. I cannot help but notice that you have yet to substantiate your previous claims as to how the system works, despite numerous request for said substantiation.

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While we encourage you to report players that are behaving in a disrespectful manner, falsely reporting another player with the sole intent of restricting their gameplay is also unacceptable and will result in penalties to your account.

https://us.battle.net/support/en/article/42673 bottom of this, idk why but i misdsed it every time i looked, luckily Mellga pointed it out.

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What if it worked like this:
After X number of reports of offense in a specific public channel, the reported individual would be silenced in that channel, until such time as a GM reviews the log. If the player actually did break the TOS (as judged by the GM at that time) then they get a complete 24 hour silence from that point forward. If innocent (as judged by the GM at that time) they get access to that specific channel back. If the GM sees that the ones filing the reports were doing so fraudulently, they all get a 48 hour total silence.

Wow, you provided a source that says false reporting can lead to actions against your account.

That does not even begin to substantiate your claims regarding exactly how the system works, though.

It also does not even begin to address how Blizzard goes about proving that Johnny is guilty of " falsely reporting another player with the sole intent of restricting their gameplay".

We forget that this tool is designed to be a good thing and that the attempt to silence was made in good faith. Blizzard may determine that neither party is at fault or maybe even both. Not everything is clear cut and a judgement call is made.

At the end of the day, we have to respect their call, but it, too, is subjective. The point is that the damage is done before it can be reviewed.

People, particularly in groups, do feign outrage at times. Groups are not inherently a bad thing, but it does have a hivemind mentality. How many times have you heard people call out to others to report said player. I’ve not always agreed that said player needed to reported, but lots can jump on the band wagon.

I cannot recall ever seeing someone called out to be reported in a local public channel without good reason. On the forums however, I see crap like that all the time. HOWEVER getting smacked with a vacation from the forum for false reporting is nowhere near as painful as it would be to get a game suspension due to the same. Which is IMHO a nice deterrent.

The main reason people used to call out for people to file reports was that it was such a pain in the butt to file them manually when you were trying to play the game, and people really needed to be motivated to do so.

This is exactly why I support a right click report system tied to an auto ignore, but NOT tied to an auto squelch. I also support the right click report system “flagging” an account for “immediate” (as soon as possible, not literally “immediately”) review if a target number of reports are received.

What if it worked like this:
After X number of reports of offense in a specific public channel, the reported individual would be silenced in that channel, until such time as a GM reviews the log. If the player actually did break the TOS (as judged by the GM at that time) then they get a complete 24 hour silence from that point forward. If innocent (as judged by the GM at that time) they get access to that specific channel back. If the GM sees that the ones filing the reports were doing so fraudulently, they all get a 48 hour total silence.

That still leaves the auto squelch option in place, though. That is what I oppose.

It also does nothing to address how Blizzard proves that “the ones filing the reports were doing so fraudulently” and that it was not just a case of those people subjectively believing that the player they reported had broken some rule.