The stars align as Padre agrees with BW
Well said.
Actually, I donât agree to anything except the forums. I no longer play WoW. Just waiting for Classic. Until that point and time, I do not agree with Blizzâs stance, except on the forums.
I donât think âJohnny wanting attention through Political meansâ is against any CoC. Thatâs on YOU (hypothetically speaking, of course) for abusing the system merely because you believe that Political Discussion shouldnât be discussed within in the Game, when the person doing it, has every right, to do so.
I donât blame system either. What I do blame are the people using the system, for all the wrong reasons, just like you. I believe everybody else is, too. However, itâs so problematic, we should re-think if the system is still a good idea or not.
And youâre talking to somebody who has been âsquelchedâ, before too. I didnât deserve it 'cause Iâve done nothing wrong. Itâs just that people get upset, when they lost their argument with me. People are very âsue happyâ. Theyâll cry wolf over anything and will squeeze any ounce they can get.
These days, people use Subjective reasoning, as opposed to objective ones. Itâs all about how they FEEL what should and shouldnât be said and abuse the system to hurt other people. Thereâs no denying that ![:confused:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/confused.png?v=6" ":confused:")
I will disagree, 'cause Iâve discussed with other individuals (and can add my own experience) who are more abrasive within their approach, however theyâre not actually harrassing, anyone nor Trolling (which is still subjective 'cause what does that mean?).
I understand Blizz has a report option for âtrollingâ, but thereâs no definitive line drawn, and it falls on the players to make that sort of judgement, you see.
People can report for âtrollingâ, over anything
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/shrug when someone can show me the purely objective rules for what should and shouldnât be said iâll be happy to follow them or argue about them.
Until then the chat rules always had some very subjective terms in them.
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And I think thatâs the main issue. Subjective terminology is easily abused whereas objective ones, are not.
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And this kind of thinking is scary, to me. Banning / muting people because theyâre discussing Politics. Which I donât like to talk about either, but at the same time, they shouldnât be banned nor muted, for doing so. Thatâs silly.
What IS inappropriate, I feel ('cause itâs all still subjective), are people telling others that theyâre bad, should uninstall, kill themselves, âyour momma jokesâ, telling others to burn in hell, etc. You know, CLEAR signs of aggression and hostility towards one another, I find more problematic that a civil Political discussion.
Of course, itâs just my opinion. Iâve learned to mentally block all of it out 'cause people are gonna be, wellâŚpeople.
https:/ /xkcd.com/1357/
People need to stop thinking that global chat channels give them the right to a captive audience.
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As far as I can tell, nothing prohibits anyone to utilize those chats, a side from the obvious. Which therein lies the problem. The same problem Iâve been discussing about this entire time.
And the replies Iâm receiving is further proof, that people are reporting for all the wrong reasons.
Nothing prohibits anyone from discussing Politics nor conversing with others, in the Global Chat especially when itâs still civil.
You canât report people because you (hypothetically speaking) donât like it, thatâs not what the system is for. But because this mentality is so popular, itâs no wonder people feel a certain way about the subject matter.
Thereâs no definitive line drawn on what can and cannot be said, other than the obvious (speech that incites violence). When people are being reported due to discussing Politics, thatâs an abuse of the system and in violation of oneâs speech.
Unless, thereâs a clear rule, by the company, where they clearly state âyou cannot discuss politicsâ, our opinions, in that regard is irrelevant, holds no merit
IDK, itâs all a gray area because everybody has their opinion about speech. There is no definitive line. If you think there is, youâre just making it up, as you go along. Which is precisely what is being done with the Report feature.
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To be fair a civil political discussion is virtually impossible on trade chat in WoW. We couldnât even be civil in a discussion about if politics should be talked about on WoW.
Throw in the fact that political discussion around here almost always means US politics and just how divisive that is especially right now, and a civil political discussion is pretty much out of the question.
All it takes is one person going âbuild the wall!â to set the entire chat off.
The reason why so many forums, chats, etc. online ban political talk is because 99.99% of the time it leads to people telling each other to kill themselves or burn in hell.
Iâm not gonna say one way of doing it is better than the other, but I will note that Iâve seen political talk on retail as well. They seem to get by just fine with the right click to report system, even without server communities to try to keep people in line.
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I agree, to a point. I donât find anything disturbing about the âbuild the wallâ, phrase, but thatâs just me. Iâve had worse speech thrown at me, like I should die, or that Iâm an idiot but whatever. You tend to grow some thick skin, if youâve been bullied your entire life. But I digress.
Iâll be on the side of reporting people, when they discuss Politics, when the company definitively says so. Until then, I cannot be alignment with reporting people, when they discuss Politics.
At this point I consider something like build the wall either purely spam or simply trolling. Either way worthy of a report in public chat channels in WoW.
What makes it âSpammyâ or âTrollyâ, though? How do we define that?
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Purely subjective of course ![:slight_smile:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/slight_smile.png?v=6" ":slight_smile:")
But itâs something thatâs been blasted across pretty much every form of media for years now and all relevant discussion has been had, either youâre wasting my time with something thatâs already been said(spam) or youâre just saying it to try to get a reaction(trolling)
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Your first statement is objectively true.
In regards to âwasting your time with something that has already been saidâ, that applies to nearly everything. To which everybody else should be held accountable, as well, Political or no.
âGetting a rise out of peopleâ, again I need that line drawn. 'Cause itâs subjective in what speech âarisesâ people. Some donât find the âbuild the wallâ phrase to be offensive, whereas others may. So, whereâs the line?
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Oh donât get me wrong I donât care whether youâre spamming something political or just saying the sky is blue.
As for your second question like I said subjective, so if you get squelched for it enough people considered it trolling.
What people donât seem to understand about the report system is that one person canât get you silenced, you have to annoy a significant chunk of the audience.
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These are the least of my worries, I am looking at the big picture rather than the myopic view that we all often dwell on.
The problem with auto squelch is far worse than just the immersion breaking stuff that I do agree exists and also annoys me, but itâs a problem promoted by the mechanism it self.
Like others have said, and I have also stated; click to report is fine, but I draw the line at right thereâŚ
The choice to make a ban or silence a player for a time should be in the hands of a real human in game GM, not some robot, no matter how impartial you would like to imagine robots asâŚ
The trouble with bots are that they are very easy to manipulate once you discover their design, and that my friend is only a matter of time.
When the bots were in strong force back in Legion when I came back to see how things were; I discovered very quickly that the bots were proficient, but they are very very flawed in that they are easy to manipulate.
Activision is a big company, but they are not a professional bot builder, they are 3rd rate at best, and the bot makers who have been crushed over and over by legal action are 100X better at it than Activison is presently.
Given the lack of experience Activision has in building bots, I do not trust them to build one good enough to handle the complex matters of in game drama or trust with them to follow fact paths and judge impartially, because those are human traits that can not presently be duplicated by machines.
Therein lies the problem. The system wasnât built for majority to squelch somebody they find âannoyingâ.
It was meant to keep the rules & regulations, in place. The majority falsely reporting because they find somebody annoying, is being as toxic, as they claim that one individual to be.
If theyâre within their legal bounds, reporting them because they annoy you, even if the majority (or as I call them, âthe cool kidsâ) agree with you, doesnât mean they should be silenced nor squelched.
'Cause if thereâs a way to appeal it because false reports happen, perhaps the majority should re-evaluate themselves and figure out EXACTLY what the rules are
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As soon as blizzard posts clear cut rules sure.
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At which time you will be presented the choice of agreeing with those terms and playing or not agreeing and not playing.
Even on the forums youâre still agreeing to follow the CoC.
Just by using the forums youâre agreeing.
No that specifically is not against the CoC.
However Johnny hitting the latest political nerve can be viewed by others as trolling.
Trolling is mentioned in the CoC.
Appreciate the benefit of doubt on this instead of claiming I must abuse the system because I defended it.
You are a gentleundead and a scholar in my book Madame. Thank you. That was refreshing around here.
While I donât like todayâs politics in my magical fantasy land of Azeroth and have never flagged anyone for it.
That isnât the entire jist of it either.
Iâve followed some political discussion in trade chat.
I watched one day as 5-6 people carried on an in depth conversation over brexit.
They seemed very well informed and spoke to each other very civilized.
I was amazed.
Now Johnnyedgelordâs political topics usually donât go anything like that discussion.
They are usually on the extreme end of the spectrum. Ofc are extremely controversial.
The dialogue is nothing resembling a discussion.
Thereâs a difference between seeking discussion and trolling.
Agree to the first part.
The part about abusing the system though in itself is subjective at this point.
We canât say why people flag a post or call the cops on you because you swerved a few times.
I see blizz as being lacking in communication here. I know big surprise.
This system has been in place for how long?
This system boiled down to cost savings and efficiency.
If blizz employees are spending most of their time unflagging innocently flagged people that is a problem to the cost savings.
In the grand scheme of the bottom line? That would be addressed.
Companies donât spend money on customers who abuse CS.
Or I could be completely wrong and itâs being abused but blizz is afraid to action anyone for fear of having to ban their paying customers and they need the money. /goldfoilhat 
Trolling is widely regarded as:
Yes they can. That is when blizz dies tge review and makes a determination.
Check out this gem of a troll here. Heâs basically doing time because he was silenced for trolling HoTs.
Then somehow thinks hoping on Facebook to threaten blizz with a gun was going to get him unmuted?
I canât even believe i just read that. Lol.
I guess this would be the extreme type if edgelord troll.
Not the funny cheeky ones who are lovable and truly hilarious.
I believe everyone is a troll to a degree. Most just arenât on the Johnnyedgelord end of the spectrum.
They lean more towards cheeky and truly comedic.
Kinda like yours truly. :)
Itâs more so that the phrase of âbuild the wallâ isnât itself a terrible thing, but it more often than not just leads to straight up inflammatory things and people telling each other to go kill themselves.
Personally Iâll just ignore people who act like idiots in trade chat, but I get why some people are wary about political talk or a few other topics like religion.
Like I said, 99.99% of the time it just leads to flame wars. I would even say itâs more likely to result in that than a âyour mammaâ joke.
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Thanks for making a fine example of why mob rule is horrible.
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