I think, maybe one of the reasons I come across as unsympathetic, is because I genuinely think this is the wrong way to look at this.
Now, Im not defending what we got in SL, that was just a bad story.
But the pay off for being the victim (the burning) and your own hero (the night warrior) was story relevance. Until now, the Night Elf role in WoW has been that ancient race that used to be important so they can explain to us youngins why illidan has horns Malfurion literally slept through three chapters of WoWs story. Even so, most of the previous nelf relevance (to a non nelf player) was to tell us things about⌠themselves.
Western storytelling goes like this⌠(almost always⌠watch any major motion picture and its practically timed out in the editing room)
You show the protagonists living their normal life. Then before it gets boring you show an event that changes everything and sends them on their journey (figurative or literal). Then there is some progress, then an unexpected defeat/loss. Next a revelation that turns the tables, and finally a confrontation with the bbg that results in the protagonist(s) emerging victorious.
In wow, the nelves have typically been absent that entire storytelling process. Sure, we have explored the ruins of a civilization of ancient elves and that has mattered, but because illidan mattered, or because Azshara and her Naga mattered. Its actually kind of mind boggling how absent and uninteresting they managed to paint the nelves for so long.
The story of what happened to the night elves is tragic. And Im sorry, but thats what makes it interesting. Look at the human kingdoms. Tell me which one is the most important to people on this subforum. If you donât say Lordaeron (or maybe Gilneas) you are lying. You canât spell empathetic without pathetic.
Not really. Making a character (in this case, the racial faction acts as a character) sympathetic, by subjecting them to tragedy is a very common storytelling device, and the night elves are not suddenly unique in this.
They didnât make Sylvanas the subject of tragedy in BFA or SL to grow her as a character.
Whatever tragedy she lived through was from WC3 and books.
The tragedy happened to Alliance faction and characters and the pay off of their suffering is growth in for the Horde and Horde characters. Which you say is the price of being involved in the process.
She did become cooler after she suffered an existential crisis and threw herself off Icecrown, went to hell, made a deal with the Valkyr and came back with renewed purpose.
This is victimhood identity. Not character victims, but real life players, identifying as the victims of abusive writers or something. You are looking for some kind of tangible or intangible reward for yourself, for the fictional tragedy that happened to Tyrande.
thats not the truth thoughâŚthey would have done that in the cinematic⌠Its one thing if it will be done in the next patchâŚbut its another thing that it was not even updated in the cinematic they JUST up outâŚ
What kind of insane thing are you saying right now?
The only people here who link their real life persona to these characters so far are certain Sylvanas fans who have ranged their talking points that as woman they identify with Sylvanas, she is a feminist icon, whoever doesnât like her is a mysogonist and so much more.
The only thing I have remarked on is that its incredibly bad optics for Blizzard to show renewal and vengeance as two mutually exclusive notions which stinks of the current debacle at Blizzard where victims were presented with two choices.
Renewal (an NDA with a big paycheck) or self-destruction in pursuit of justice (pursuing the wrong dooer)
The only thing I am talking about is the story and its characters.
This is very basic story telling where you have story elements being presented like the Night Warrior, Teldrassil burning, Risen Night Elf forsaken and then the story does absolutely nothing to develop them further.
Burning happened because it happened. boohoo sad.
Tyrande is back where she starded but with a new 3d model.
The forsaken night elves are forgotten
and the only thing that came out of all this is the Horde is a council now and Sylvanas is sad but nice now. I remark that the only growth and change is with the Horde and its characters and Alliance were used as tools to deliver that.
But to you apparently thats the price of admission to have Alliance faces in the story and if you are complaining about it then its some deep psychological issue?
I agree. And I think it lends even more credibility to the rewrite theory.
I imagine the original plan had a cinematic that made Sylvanas look too heroic, so they had to make a new cinematic making her look pitiful. The original just wouldnt fit with the story they ended up telling.
My personal annoyance is the nature of âredemption/possibility of redemptionâ. I keep thinking of how the good place or Lucifer did it. With basically everyone getting their shot at redemption, even the worse of the worse in Luciferâs case. If the whole Arthas cinematic did not happen I might be less annoyed by the whole thing.
Nonono. I get that, and if you had ended with that Id have said , âYeah⌠bad move blizzardâ but then you followed it up by pretending that you are only talking about the story. The characters. It was actually a sandwich where you suggested you dont mix it up with real life, only Sylvanas fans do that. Then you criticized Blizzards story for mirrioring their villainous employment practices, then topped it off by reiterating that you are superiorly only talking about the story.
But sheâs not back where she started. She moved from the backâ behind more important menâ to the front.
She brought with her, her race, of supposedly warlike amazonian warriors and priests, and put them at the front of faction conflict. The tragedy that befell them is motivation for co tinued badassery.
Sorry, but thats just not âback where she started.â
I never said I donât draw messaging from Blizzardâs story telling and how it relates to real life.
Everyone does it here, Baal is more focused on social commentary and Ren talks about it as female experience and their place in the world.
This is completely different than the accusation you have leveled against me that actually implies I am somehow identifying myself as a night elf and the slights upon them are slights upon me. Which is absolutely insane.
No I am not a night Elf and I donât identify my life or personhood as a night elf or their story in wow. If anyone here does should probably seek help.
Yes because every story has a message and if that message is a bad take then that deserves to be criticized. Baal has an entire twitter army ready to mobilize at the slightest hint from Blizzard (no complaint from me) or community Council members (I donât support that bit)
As a character, her personality and her journey she is exactly where she started out as at beginning of BFA. You are conflating character growth and character exposure as one and the same.
Here is a little exercise.
As a character where was Sylvanas when BFA started and shadowlands ended.
And where was Tyrande?
Sylvanas got her soul back, she is more collected, she actually has remorse and self reflection. She got closure on many issues and is now going to hell to make a penance.
I can clearly point towards differences of behavior and personality of Sylvanas.
Can you do the same to Tyrande? Or is she merely appearing in the expansion enough of a character growth?
Im sorry thats the impression you got. That would be crazy. I dont think, and I dont think anyone believes, that you believe you are a night elf.
I am accusing you of identifying as an alliance fan, and that anything tragic that happens to the alliance in narrative is an offense against you, and that you are entitled to compensation for said offense. That if, in recompense for said offense, you do not recieve your pound of flesh, or if your chosen fandom is not made somehow whole at the end of the chapter, somehow satisfying your sense of justice, you feel personally slighted.
There is no offense. An offense implies that I am indeed larping as an actual âinsert fantasy race hereâ
The only feeling I feel is disappointment.
To keep it as simple as possible it is this:
Blizzard takes a story decision that sucked⌠because something was taken away or changed. And so as a viewer I want to see how that is addressed.
Blizzard as tone deaf as they are knew of this.
Early in BFA there was a huge outcry from Horde fans about why were they made to be war criminals.
And in an interview Terran Gregory, the guy in charge of cinematics, was saying he wanted to tell fans to be patient because those Saurfang cinematics were coming and they would recontextualize everything.
How would you describe those Horde fans? Also offended? Are they also irrationally personally looking for their pound of flesh as you say? I personally donât think so.
And so Blizzard made three cinematics for the Horde.
Then they had the rebellion questline
A new horde completely reorganized horde.
And the chief architect of all this drama, Sylvanas also got an ending and resolution to all this.
Its not perfect and I am sure the execution left a lot of Horde fans wanting but at least it is something right?
Well lets look at what the Alliance experience was. Afterall we are in this game too and I think besides playing a secondary support role there should have been some development on our end too.
Ok so Jaina went from âI love the Hordeâ to âBeware of meâ back to âI love the Horde but only some of themâ
Tyrande went from angry moon priestess to avenger who didnât avenge and then back to angry moon priestess lady.
During the entirety of BFA they kept teasing an Alliance response is coming, they teased some political strife between the leaders but ultimately none of that panned out.
Alliance never got any of those Cinematic goodness the Horde got⌠I think Alliance races can be interesting and so can their characters⌠should they not get something similar? I donât think its insane to expect that.
If I described myself as more Horde fan I can clearly point out to the conclusive âpayoffsâ these stories delivered.
As an Alliance fan I cannot. You say Allianceâs mere existence in the story is enough I say differently.
Perhaps Horde fans may understand this if I compare this to legion. How involved did they feel in that story? Was it good? Thats where Alliance is right now.
Imagine Voljin was brutally killed by an Alliance character and for the rest of Legion and Legion 2.0 you just follow the Alliance story and Blizzard keeps teasing you that something amazing is on the way.