I’ll see that and raise you one.
The prototypes you get from scrapping have a 50% chance of being learned when you dissemble it (Don’t remember the actual spell and beta is down.)
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Seems they have made some changes to the profession with the new build.
Scrapping can give “Unrecognizable prototype”
Hastily scrawled notes combine at 15 vice 30 (This is a big change I think)
Pilfer through parts is now learnable from the trainer.
Invent is now a 24hr CD.
Probably more, but those are the big items I noticed right away.
Issues: Currently unable to learn the “Tinker: Lightning Tether” schematic (which also does not show up in the unlearned items). AND I’m at the point where the last 2 times I’ve used notes to learn a new schematic all 3 choices are the tether, this effectively breaks the profession as I can’t learn anything else.
Also unable to craft “Lapidary’s Bismuth Clamps” and “Pausing Pylon”
Noted something I am really not happy about… you have to have 30/30 goggles/guns/bracers to be able to use “enchanted crests” this seems to now be baseline across all professions. Not a fan of the change as it will further isolate the market for crafting to those that grind it quickly.
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So you can get scrap from the marked treasures like Machine Speakers Reliquary, Pile of Refuse, etc at a very high rate (I want to say 100% chance, but can’t confirm). You can also get them from those purple dirt piles on the ground (the ones you get the wax from, the ones generating those annoying “defend from the kobold” announcements). Those give a lot more scrap. Treasures typically give 1 scrap. The purple dirt piles give 2-3 scrap. There are some special named treasures like Etched Machine Speaker’s Reliquary that give 4+.
There are also some robots in the second zone, e.g. High Speaker’s Construct in Khaz Algar /way 49, 19 that are marked that they can be scrapped by engineering but do not currently drop anything. I suspect that when they get around to it, that will also be a source of scrap.
Oh, and don’t forget there’s a mining node we haven’t seen yet that is supposed to involve explosives.
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You can also sometimes get a choice between the same schematics, which kinda sucks.
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I saw the mining node in a delve last night, however I was not on an engineer/miner so just had to stare at it in amazement.
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This. I’m stuck in beta currently due to this. I’m max level however I can’t learn anything else since it gives me the lightning tether tinker option x3 every time and the recipe is bugged/not in game yet. So I am unable to learn any new recipes until they fix it.
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I think you missed the point many of us made that even with getting that stuff it is still incredibly hard to level up.
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So with the changes that hit now, your best source right off the bat is the pilfer ability. It allows you to get scrap from all the previous expac engineering parts. I had a ton of DF eng mats still, and got probably 2k+ scrap from that. Seeing how the price can drop on DF mats, it may be worth it to stock up on ore/elements to make DF parts so you can pilfer through it all to have a huge stock built up right away.
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There is a reason for that, currently if you try to learn the prototypes by using them instead of scraping them for papers, you will brick your profession and it becomes impossible to advance past that point. There is also several more ways to brick engineering that I have reported but nothings been fixed or changed yet. Which is incredibly worrying because its very easy to perma brick the profession and with how its designed, you need to unlearn and redo it all again to even attempt to advance past the brick.
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I have scrapped every prototype I’ve gotten, but definitely seems like there are some major issues they need to work out still.
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I would love to test this in beta, but I can’t even get enough scrap to reach level 5 to learn pilfer. I am killing literally everything I can. I am doing every delve, every quest, every bonus objective. This is absolutely a horrible grind and will be a nightmare for most players.
So far, best place I’ve found to get scrap is in the Disturbed Earth. It’s the rocks that are highlighted purple like a treasure. They’re somewhat easy to spot when gliding around. And they seem to respawn after some time, though I don’t know what.
It does feel like they should drop from mobs at some point, but haven’t found any yet; though they only drop if you have engineering - and I only started playing with it recently.
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It is ludicrous we even have to discuss that in order to level a profession.
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Please keep in mind that the professions are nowhere near ready.
We are missing Aqirite in the open world. There are no EZ-Mine nodes. My warband bank is duplicating items. All concentration computations are incorrect for crafts whose max rank is Rank 3. Ingenuity buffs are NYI. Mining overloads aren’t working. My warband bank is glitching by swapping tab 3 and 4. Values (that the OP probably tested with) are just placeholders. They are adding and removing items with every build. They don’t have the pvp items ready for crafting. Crafting orders don’t work. Crafting orders when they glitch are giving skill ups when the craft can’t be completed. Tailoring has no starting items on eleven server since Tuesday. Tailoring has no reasonable source for weaver cloth. Enchanting has no reasonable source for dust. Etc. etc.
This is beta so please expect things to be quite broken…
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The changes so far have been great. Sounds like all they need now are dummy prototypes which can’t be learned but can be scrapped into notes. That way even if learn all real prototypes you still have a source for notes.
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That is true. However, most of the issues people are raising with engineering are design choices, not something that can be attributed to bugs.
Even if they fix the bugs (the minimum expected) and make scrap exceedingly plentiful, it wont address the core issue of RNG stacking on top of RNG being the way you learn most of the schematics.
The core philosophy needs changed if we are to have any hope of engineering being competitive and not exceedingly frustrating.
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A mechanism to find missing recipes is common to alchemy and engineering. it is luck the order in which you find them. In alchemy its a 2 day cooldown. In engineering its a scheme designed to cause repetitive strain from clicking. I prefer the alchemy method.
To get the epic gem recipes for JC it’s world drops from a particular area. I loathe that method most of all - can see they’ll be on ah for 1.000,000 gold depending on the drop rate.
I understand why they might want to gate recipes and give a random order of discovery. But it should be i) not time intensive and ii) not have lots of built in failures.
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There are a couple key differences that make the engineering design even worse, even if we assume Scrap will get buffed to be as reliably available as herbs.
The biggest: Alchemy is not stacking RNG on top of itself several times over. Engineering you have RNG determining if you even get Disassemble Invention. Then you have RNG on IF you get prototype. Then you have RNG on which one. Then you have RNG using the Prototype to determine if it works and you learn it. If you scrap the prototype it is RNG how many notes you get. Then when you use the notes it is RNG which schematic you can learn.
Second, Alchemy gets useful items basically immediately from the trainer. Even if you don’t get lucky for the best recipes right away you can be making useful items right off the bat. Where even the engineering parts are locked behind RNG.
And that is before you even consider that experimenting with concoctions is thematically fitting for Alchemy. I would argue it is not for engineering.
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Apologies Meringue, I should have quoted the other fellow to clarify what I was addressing. I was only referring to the previous post about finding scrap and that is all. I was making no comment about the “core philosophy”.
I was trying to encourage this person not to assume that there are no reasonable sources for scrap since many other professions are also missing their resource gathering methods and there are many systems not yet working correctly.
Sorry for the confusion.
Fair.
And I might have assumed a little. Lots of people play this ‘just wait, it isn’t done’ thing during betas as a way of dismissing complaints. And I may have read a little of that into your post. So, my apologies. With only typed messages, it is easy to misunderstand.
Based on what we have seen. I think Blizzard’s intent is for scrap to be farmed from mobs and treasures. Which, I feel is poorly thought out. But quantity certainly needs to be significantly more than what is there.
My feedback for Blizzard on scrap is: If they are not willing to redesign the insanely bad system, then scrap needs to be at least as plentiful as cloth, probably more so. Because most of it is going to be wasted on the RNG.
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