So I was helping a buddy through a heroic dungeon to help him gear up and because he is not the greatest tank and was pulling a little slow the healer and other dps kick him. Why does my buddy get a deserter debuff because he was not pulling at lightning speed?
Well my guild came together and helped him with a mythic 0 so it became moot at that point but the point remains… why punish players like that?
Can someone explain to me what things take to get the deserter buff. because returning players can just decide to quit because people abuse the systems.
Kicks can be for any reason, and they will result in the deserter debuff. You don’t need to be doing anything wrong. I was just reading CS and someone described it like, “they can vote kick for a valid reason, for a laugh, or for no reason at all.” Which is completely true, per policy. Found it:
And so at this point, usually the people who feel they’ve been inappropriately slapped with a deserter debuff will say, “that system sucks, it’s open to abuse, it shouldn’t be that way,” etc.
This, to me, is easy to explain and understand.
We have to have a way to remove disruptive / AFK / trolling people from groups.
There cannot be a GM / MVP / Blizzard employee determination on every removal.
Seriously, there cannot be. How many tens of thousands of VTKs get initiated in a day, world-wide? Is Blizz going to hire a thousand new employees to handle this?
And if they did, what of it? Just because you have an arbitrator does not mean you will agree with their decision.
Answer: Let the majority rule. For any reason. There literally is no other, fairer, way to have this (necessary) system in place.
Vote kick is fine, mostly, the deserter is unneeded though. All deserter being attached to vote kick does is hurt people who get kicked for stupid reasons like the OPs friend.
Re-read my post, including my bullet points on why such a system is necessary, and then post back here, on how the “victims” should be sorted out from the “offenders”.
Or, are you saying that if the system was ditched entirely, there would be some other way to handle trolls?
Re-read my points again, and understand that when I say “system”, I mean the entire system as it is now, VTKs and debuffs.
But OK, since you probably won’t go back and read, then you say “remove deserter”, right? So if someone does troll, and gets VTK, they can just re-queue, and re-queue, and re-queue, with no consequences?
There has to be a consequence aside from just being removed. Otherwise the vote kick carries no weight. And there has to be weight, or the offenders will repeat.
You do realize you can report trolls right? Disrupting gameplay is a suspendable offense. Report them, kick them, move on. Deserter ONLY hurts those who get kicked for stupid reasons.
You’re basically pulling “cut off the leg to spite the foot”
The words of someone who clearly wasn’t around when they first introduced LFD and experienced tanks and healers holding groups hostage to avoid doing dungeons they didn’t like.
Yeah, OK. So you are onboard with making the system even more loose, and open to abuse. Lulz. Thanks for the (limited) discussion, though.
BTW, my entire original post was about the deserter debuff, so I am not sure where you got the idea that my points were not about that thing.
Maybe suggest your own system? Reporting people is fine, and should be done, but that is not going to save your dungeon or raid run. I don’t think you are seeing this from both sides.
But you’re saying with no penalty like the deserter debuff? That’s the reason it was introduced to begin with, to discourage hostage situations like in Wrath.
You’re a DPS in queue for 30 minutes. I’m the tank. I tell the group, “I don’t like this dungeon. Kick me.” I won’t get a deserter debuff so I don’t care. You would have to wait possibly another 30 minutes for another tank.
There’s always gotta be one whose anger or pain, or both, is so terrible and deep inside that they have to wish it and literally try to deliver it onto other people.
I disagree with your standpoint on deserter debuffs. Like, hard disagree.
However, as a human, to another human, I don’t wish you a terrible day. I don’t even know you, and we are just discussing things.
You may understand this in ten, twenty years. Maybe. Hopefully.