Dual Spec.. please?

WoW Classic Cataclysm Classic Discussion
3766

Like I said, this is like valuing the opinion of a dentist for your ophthalmology needs. They didn’t design TBC, and they are deferring to the people who did for changes that they’ve made.

There’s no sufficient evidence to be able to make this claim.

https://www.mobygames.com/game/windows/world-of-warcraft-the-burning-crusade/credits

https://www.mobygames.com/game/windows/world-of-warcraft-wrath-of-the-lich-king/credits

There’s obviously some overlap here and there with the “old guard” but there are notable distinctions/replacements/changes.

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3767

Logic is logic - it runs according to rules. With the “examples of contradictions” you gave you fundamentally failed to demonstrate a single valid instance where I made a contradictory claim. That’s not up for debate, that’s fact. You conflated cause with correlation and mis applied implication as bidirectional. You then read my two distinct claims as contradictory as a result of your faulty reasoning.

Not only this but you claim that I am continually contradicting myself and yet you have failed to demonstrate a single valid instance where this is the case.

Sophistry is your botched attempt at a smear campaign. What you are doing is sophistry.

If you want to convince people I made contradictions all you have to do is demonstrate them - should be easy enough - if they exist.

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3768

More vague sophistry.

3769

How is this for sophistry - in simple speak:

Give a single example of where I contradicted myself. Just one valid one will do.

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3770

Did already. You re-quoted it just a few posts ago before, shortly after you told me you would no longer interact with me. You have goldfish memory.

3771

It was provably not a contradiction - I demonstrated that already.

Since you wont restate the “contradiction” I see no reason why I should restate my refutation of it.

You basically fall back on insults because you have nothing.

‘Goldfish memory’ what, are you 8 years old?

This whole thing is your attempt to trash my reputation because you have no reasonable answer. So all you have left is childish name calling and trumped up smears. Pathetic.

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3772

You used reams of text and vague sophistry to turn up into down.

https://c.tenor.com/4nry3Niu8OYAAAAC/lord-of-the-rings-speak.gif

3773

You claimed I contradicted myself - you were wrong and I demonstrated why.

Rather than go on wiki and quote all the fallacies you used to reach your conclusion about me I chose to break it down and describe where your whole logic was flawed and why - from first principles.

If you can’t come to grips with that then maybe go read a book on logic or something - it’s not my problem. Your lack of understanding is not an example of sophistry on my part.

If you are going to accuse people of being contradictory at least do everyone the service of understanding what the word “contradictory” actually means.

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3774

Uh-huh. You demonstrated in a way very fitting of someone who wants to use vague sophistry as a way of trying to talk one’s way out of anything.

3775

I think he is using the same logic that the pro dual spec clowns use of “if you don’t want dual specs you’re a nochanges zealot and you couldn’t possibly be somechanges”

3776

People said the same thing in the multiboxer threads. There was never a blue response, until the banned key repeating software and hardware. People said the same thing in the threads about the drum problem. There was no blue response, until they nerfed drums. Blizzard doesn’t engage in discussion with the players. They remain silent, either doing nothing or eventually making a change. I have no idea what the outcome will be but I’ll continue to post on the threads seeking dual spec, just as I continued to post on the threads against multiboxing. Blizzard doing nothing is usually a good bet but you never know what’s going to happen

3777

It’s not for you to judge what’s right and wrong. You can have your own opinion but that doesn’t have to be the correct one. :slight_smile:

And none of them are real reasons, as dual specs won’t bring that problematic:

I don’t know how open world content would become easier. You have your raid spec and your pvp spec or dungeon spec. Or you play healer and tank. A spec for farming? Well, maybe, but it won’t change as much for them. I don’t think you would farm a lot faster compared to your raid spec.

Only exceptions are maybe tanks and healer, but do we really want to punish them for playing the important specs in raids?

One of your arguments was, that gold is already farmed very fast etc. When people really want to min max for the content, because they can’t get it cleared without, do you really think they won’t min max right now as well?

There are also work arounds for it. Dual spec only in major cities usable. Raid IDs are locked to the specialization you killed the first boss with and so on.

Ehm, There was a guild that leveled from 60 to 70 and cleared stage 1 completely in less than 24 hours. I don’t know if you can burn any faster through the content. :laughing:

And hardcore raid guilds who want to burn through the content will anyways, as they can min max the talents for each encounter anyways.

So for the last time: Dual spec doesn’t bring more possibilities to the game, it just removes the over extensive gold costs if you want to enjoy more than just one content.

It saves the time for some gold farming that can be invested into other content the whole game benefits from. More tanks/healer for dungeons (it’s not solving the problem, but no matter what, it’s better with than without), More people who queue for arena. More PvP player who participate in raids/dungeons. And so on.

Probably because they weren’t even worth it to discuss about.

Last but not least: HOW does all of that have a negative impact ON YOUR gaming experience? I don’t get it. Why do you care about how fast others get through the content? Or if they min/max?

Your reasonings are nothing else than an opinion. You maybe don’t like that other guild are rushing through the content. But only because they rush, doesn’t mean you have to rush. It doesn’t affect you at all! When you go for a walk in the park, it doesn’t bother you that a group of cyclists or joggers make their rounds much faster, does it?

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3778

I don’t even know what Riger’s opinion is. Does he know what his opinion is?

Again, not even sure what he thinks a “point” is. Like I can say, “I want Dual Spec because I like cupcakes!”

That can be considered a point. Not sure why my raising it entails it is worth anyone else’s time responding to it or taking it seriously.

I think he means “easier” as in it will be easier to do PvE content as a DPS spec versus a Healing spec. Problem with this is that this still neglects the fact that people can already do this through respecs anyway.

This is the problem with most if not all of Riger’s “arguments.” They’re based in a world where respecs don’t already exist as a thing players can do. All of his arguments hinge on a non-reality. It’s not like we’re asking for the ability to respec because that already exists in the game.

Dual Spec merely makes the entire process of respeccing more convenient for everyone.

Same thing as above. People can already do this because respeccing exists in the current game.

Correct. None of it is worth discussing because it’s deals with a non-reality.

If we played a game where respecs did not exist, then all of what he is proposing might be tenable. However, none of it is.

And he’ll continually argue for it regardless because he is continually self-contradictory.

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3779

The dude can’t provide an example of anything when asked, it’s the same for his so called poll on dual spec that doesn’t exist which he uses to back the entire premise behind the argument that Blizzard will implement it because it “polled well” in their data.

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3780

You mean all this?

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3781

So basically because we want a change that we see good for the game work clowns now OK.

Just like Clearly we only want dual spec because we want it not at all because we see it could be a very massive good change for the game.

Just like the same argument you make I could say you only don’t want dual respect because you don’t want it.

3782

No, the method used is what is making me view most pro dual spec people as clowns.

Insults, lies, twisting quotes to give false representation of what was being quoted, the refusal to provide evidence for claims made and demanding we give evidence when they are the one proposing the change, exc.

3783

No DS for you! Instead you get a garbage version of vanilla with a whole bunch of changes lol

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3784

…is what I said.

Then you said…

proceeds to link a poll by forum poster without a single blue post in it

Are you trying to be an absolute parody?

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3785

It’s OK I guess it depends on what your definition is your definition is of lies false perception what are you talking about there’s a lot of people that want dual speck just like there’s a lot of people that don’t.

I can only speak for myself I’ve never attacked anyone specific Now if you see a point I disagree with oh yeah I’m going to argue it.

As far as evidence of claims not to be mean but the same argument could be made against your claims there is no proof saying that.

What you say of dual speck What happened any more than there’s proof of what we would say what happened at the end of the day we won’t know until blizzard lets us test it on a ptr.

I argue I’ve broughten up argument several times the thing is You guys see them differently than we do.

Is plain and simple