Uh…is there a problem that needs fixing?
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The main reason people want dual-spec is to address tank/healer shortages. How is your solution a middle-ground?
Then you know what, add in more incentives for TBC tanking.
Because you said it right there.
So dual spec, by itself, is not enough to fix the tank problem.
yeah, it’s why I made a dk and used LFD for the two heroics that dropped mounts in LK.
But outside of those two instances, my tank did not help the tank shortage.
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You’re either on a very good server or you’re lying. a 20 to 40 minute wait time for dps would be a vast improvement on my server
Like 80% Horde pop. Instant queue when I’m with my boys because we lack a single dps.
Edit: You know I’ve said 20-40 minutes before, we had a conversation about this like yesterday.
Well I counter this by saying that adding dual spec will not fix tank or healer shortages.
And since it will not do what they want, that’s even more of a reason to not add a feature that never actually existed in this expansion and would break the game design.
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What we expect is not a fix but for the wait times to be less.
Sadly LFD which had a huge amount of very bad consequences was the only thing that allowed the satchels to exist because it let the system know what role you were.
It isn’t just that people don’t want to tank, it is that raid dynamics inevitably create a tank shortage. Also, tanks are pretty useless in PvP and for farming.
To fix the tank problem you would have to make every 25-man raid require 5 tanks, make tanks better in PvP, and to make tanks better at farming.
No one claimed that there would never be a shortage of tanks ever again once they introduce dual-spec. Just that it would improve the current situation.
Weird flex but okai
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Are you saying that dual-spec would have no effect on the number of tanks? Or just that it wouldn’t do enough?
Sadly LFD with dual spec didn’t stop the tank shortage.
So why are we still discussing that the idea of dual spec by itself will?
Yes
Need a tank for WSG flag carrying once the Druid runs it, need a tank for AB base sitting, need a tank for flag running or base sitting in Eye, need a tank for bosses in AV. Tanks are useless in only arena.
Cap, I watched prot paladins murder more mobs than I could in less time, while I was a pure dps class and spec. Farming is also moot unless you’re a skinner. Fishing, cooking, and well all professions except skinning don’t require talents.
I said it to the other guy, pissing on a forest fire is technically helping, but is it really.
Also, I went through and did basic math for you and you’re ignoring it, I even made it in the tanks favor by saying that there is atleast 333 prot warriors, when we know that there is barely 1,000 warriors on a heavy pop server to begin with.
Sorry not sorry that I’m not broke.
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Noone is saying dual spec is a magical unicorn that fixes tank/healer shortage.
It will help it though, which is all we can expect.
/10 characters
I’ll give you AV, but the rest, no.
You said it would be a 20-30% increase in tanks. Honestly, I have no clue how many it would be, all I know is that it would be more.
I get triggered when people like Zipzo make this all-or-nothing fallacy where unless there is a 100% solution, then there is no solution. It would be like if something would reduce poverty from 10% to 1%. It technically doesn’t solve poverty if it still exists, but a 20% or a 30% or a 90% solution is better than a 0% solution.
You can’t say that if a vaccine isn’t 100% effective then it doesn’t do anything.
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A 30% increase in tanks, especially when DPS can’t just put themselves in a queue and wait for the join pop would be huge.
You know. Then where is your evidence, because I feel like I’m being generous with my number. We’re talking people who don’t want to tank so they won’t OS into it, and those who want to pvp won’t OS into tank.
I’m arguing that it won’t make an significant change. Even in my example, I note at the bottom that it’s a perfect scenario where every tank is on all the time and willing to do instances. It still leaves thousands of dps just sitting there, with nothing.
Yet if you look at my scenario, it’s a perfect case and still leaves thousands of dps without tanks. We’d still be in a massive tank shortage.
Edit: Then you didn’t do serious RBGs when they came out. Always needed 1 tank.
no go to retail
Honestly I don’t think a middle ground is necessary. I originally advocated it but I don’t actually think there is a problem with the TBC classic game that dual spec can fix.
Further to that I don’t think compromise will stop those advocating for dual spec from pushing for more and more changes to further casualize the game.
In the end it will drive the game toward the more casualized adhoc socialising that later editions of the game had and that dilutes TBC classic into a form of TBC lite. Later classic editions will add it - there’s no reason not to wait and have something to look forward to. No reason to dilute the TBC experience.
Once again noone is claiming it’s a complete solution. But is it the difference between finding a tank/healer in 10/20 minutes or your group breaking up?