One of my Wish list for Holy is not to have to choose between Awakening and Avenging Crusader and to be able to pick both.
Or even put Awakening into Class tree and be affect by Holy Power Spender similar to Divine Purpose.
3 Likes
One thing I noticed is that the new wording implies that the Consecrated Blade version of Consecration does not have a limit itself, so if you get lucky, you could get 3 Consecrations at once? Maybe even 4? I dunno, I can’t test it myself.
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Yeah, basically. You’d have to be very lucky to get more than 3 running from this talent at any given point but you can add the vanilla one on top to of course.
With improved AoW and supposing you attack once every sec you’d get 3 proc on average over 12 sec.
Needless to say this doesn’t happen because we don’t attack that fast with 2handers. For example that would be mean 100% uptime of Seraphim right now.
In dungeon I get about 40% uptime in combat with the procs alone so that’s 1.2 proc over 12 sec, so yeah.
All this to say, we’d be lucky to see 3 consec from the talent overlapping. Not impossible but unlikely.
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I’d be including the regular Consecration in that but yeah.
Also, unrelated, but still a problem: you HAVE to pick 9 talents at the top of the tree right now to advance all three branches. Kinda weird we’re not just given Blade of Justice so it can actually be 8, as intended…
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I share your concern. They could also give BoJ the 2 HP straight up and shuffle the template a bit.
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I know I’m replying late to the party, but that’s exactly what Denounce is for, and exactly why I want it back!
…Well, that, and the fact that our spellbook casting animation is begging to be used for a projectile spell!
Personally, I think requiring anyone who wants Speed of Light to get Cleanse and Golden Path isn’t the best way. Of course, that’s going back to my don’t-put-something-players-want-behind-something-they-don’t-want rule, which I guess you don’t agree with, at least not 100%.
The idea was to put Pursuit of Justice and Unbound Freedom on the “ret side” while also keeping Long Arm of the Law in the Ret Tree. This way, Retribution felt more like a “lawful avenger” then this super speedy knight.
However, considering most other classes increase to mobility, I thought Paladins would maybe end up needing a little extra. Speed of Light would still just be one charge though, to make sure Paladin mobility didn’t get quite out of hand.
Cleanse I think is a pretty decent staple in the Paladin toolkit, honestly I do not think that Cleanse or “lesser CC” options should be talents at all. Cleanse, Turn Evil, Hibernate, Soothe, Shackle, etc… are too niche most of the time to be in the talent tree and it usually feels bad to spend a talent point on it.
This however, felt the most iconic “low impact” that would warrant it being at the top of the tree.
Golden Path just seemed like it would be a decent options for all 3 specs, especially considering the amount of Consecration buffs that are appearing in this expansion, so I figured it would be the one with the most justification across the board.
Another option, instead of Cleanse, could always be Shielding Words (SL Conduit).
2 Likes
The Dragonflight Ret Paladin tree is looking good. Judging from the talents available Haste will be on top once again.
I’m more interested in were Crit and Mastery will stand. I’m tired of secondary stat values being equal for most of an expansion. The ability to choose a path for a Mastery build or Crit build would be refreshing.
If Expurgation is moved down the tree with additional talents to buff it then critical strike based builds would be an option.
1 Like
This is something I am really interested in, and wish someone would take the time to ask them as personally it feels very disconnected.
The identity, theme or class fantasy of ALL Paladins has been stripped to the bone over the years, and when Blizzard attempts to return it, it always feels half-baked or rushed.
Auras are a prime example, to maybe Divine Steed and now spells like Exorcism.
Paragons Of Justice - Class Identify:
When it comes to paladin’s class identity, we’ve had some really class defining talents and abilities along the way that really sold the idea of “bringing justice to the unjust and to vanquish evil.”
Paladins had abilities like:
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Pursuit of Justice
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Seal of Justice
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Judgment of Justice
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Long Arm of the Law
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Exorcism
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Holy Wrath
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Turn Evil
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Sense Undead
However, most of these class defining abilities had been stripped away and we now have cumbersome, dated or watered-down versions of these spells.
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Pursuit of Justice, Seals, Judgements, Holy Wrath— all removed.
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Long Arm of the Law and Exorcism are returning, but feel pretty lackluster to previous versions, which doesn’t help emphasize this identity.
- And are not being introduced for Holy and Prot. -
Turn Evil feels cumbersome with both a cooldown and cast time.
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Sense Undead feels dated in 2022, especially considering spells like Spectral Sight
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How cool would it be as a flavor spell to give Paladins a golden spectral sight ability? (Maybe it’s not for you, but it’s an RP thing in a RPG video game)
Questions:
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How do you plan to bring back the sense of being a Paragon of Justice to not only Ret paladins, but all Paladins?
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Is this no longer the internal view of Paladins?
The Light and How to Show It - Class Visuals:
We wanted to give Holy Paladin abilities a clear and identifiable theme to further differentiate them from Holy Priest. A Paladin carries the light within them and radiates righteousness, so I tried to realize that theme visually wherever possible. Their abilities carry more warmth and physicality than a Priest, who casts a more pure and prisming light.
One of the things that has really begun to feel outdated on Paladins are the visuals. Our visuals have undoubtedly changed over the years, but some notable spells have continued to be stuck in 2004.
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Auras not having any visuals at all feels like a missed opportunity,
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Consecration is very lackluster and I know that it was going to get a visual update, but that got scrapped, but now with it becoming a more prominent spell for all specs, it would be pretty cool to see this updated.
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Holy Prism and Light’s Hammer …
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BoJ seems super weird having a Paladin unsheathe a Blade from the ground, it feels more of a Death Knight thing as paladins more often than not call to the heavens.
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Wake of Ashes is a little missed on me, doesn’t feel like it packs the same punch as Sundering or Warbreaker.
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Blessed Hammer is a bit of an acquired taste, but seems a bit too much on the cartoonish side, for my personal liking.
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Hammer of Wrath and Judgment share the same visual, super weird.
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Blessings feel a bit outdated compared to Blessings of Seasons, however that was never a “meta pick” in SL so sadly saw very limited use.
Questions:
- Obviously this isn’t top of the list, but this is for the visual artists, are there any plans to improve the VFX (not necessarily the animations) for Paladins?
Mobility: ______ 
_____ 
__________
From Legion introducing Demon Hunters, to Evokers and Dragon Riding in Dragonflight along with new talent revamps, it is clear to see that there will be this new amplification on mobility.
Simply put, mobility is fun.
Every class will have substantially better mobility… except Paladins. A lot of classes on live had competing talents when it came to mobility, however most of these are now incorporated into the new DF talent trees as coexisting options.
Warriors will have access to Charge, Double Time, Heroic Leap and Stormbolt.
Rogues will have access to Sprint, Grapple and Shadow Step.
Shamans will have access to Ghost Wolf, Thunder storm, and Gust of Wind.
Just to give a few examples.
Paladins will be stuck with the same Divine Steed, with a 4 point investment to just make that ONE mobility button “work.”
Questions:
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Why the obsession with Divine Steed?
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Do you think the over thematic graphic fits what the spell actually does?
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Do you think this graphic isn’t obnoxious while in close quarter combat or interior spaces?
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Do you think each Race has a justifiable connection to their “Charger?” (Tauren and Zandalari)
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Will there ever be an option to replace it with Speed of Light?
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How do you feel about ALL paladins getting better mobility?
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What are your thoughts on Pursuit of Justice?
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What are your thoughts on the Z-axis movement?
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When will we see Falling Sword added to WoW?
Utility - Blessings and Auras -
-“for both themselves and their party”
Where do we even begin?
Questions:
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How does Blizzard feel Blessings and Auras are working out in World of Warcraft in 2022?
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Will Paladins see Greater Blessings, such as Wisdom, Might, Kings, Salvation, or Light make a comeback?
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What are the impacts of ST Blessings vs group utility tools? Is Sacrifice weighed the same as RoP, Mass Root, or Vortext, for example?
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How do you classify “Auras” in World of Warcraft now?
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Does Retribution Aura, Crusader Aura(Seal of the Templar), Vengeance Aura and Aura of Reckoning classify as “Auras” as these do not benefit both themselves and their party?
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Could the above Auras be adjusted to benefit the group? (See Leader of the Pack(PvP Talent))
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Will Aura Mastery become class wide?
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Recompense – why?
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Will BoP see a shorter cooldown?
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Will Unbound Freedom be added to the Class Tree?
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Will Spreading the Word and/or Blessed Hands be added to the Class Tree?
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Will Scared Duty be added to the class tree?
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Will Uther’s Devotion be added to the class tree?
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Will we see offensive Blessings?
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What lessons were learned from Blessings of Seasons?
15 Likes
I think its just a temporary text cause Holy tree hasnt been released. Cause it make 0 sense adding talent in spec tree and say its just Prot/ret. But if you check all talent got that typo so my guess is its just temporary
1 Like
How does player housing (cough garrisons) have anything to do with paladins themselves? Shouldn’t that be a game feature not a class one?
Just asking out of curiousity.
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I think a lot of people including me were disappointed that Player housing was dropped at the end of WoD and Legion where we got a Paladin hall.
What does player housing have to do with the Paladin class?
What do you want player housing to have to do with the Paladin class?
That is up to us and to the WoW devs.
2 Likes
So i take it has 0 to do with the class then.
Why add it in the thread then?
Also i don’t think player housing is worth doing as a standalone. If it was going to be a thing, they should update garrisons with an additio an building for the player house and allow you to choose which zone to put the garrison in.
3 Likes
Did you have anything to say about the DF paladin class?
I am not a fan of the current holy spec. I have another more played holy paladin since vanilla that has been dormant since Legion. I did not play her in BFA or Shadowlands.
The holy spec has been empty since the Artifact mace was emasculated.
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I didn’t really liked it in BFA but I kinda liked it in SL but at the same time I use a weird build so. Im playing with Beacon of Virtue unlike most pally. Usually my beacon count for over 50% of my overall healing ^^
1 Like
Hey all!
At first, I didn’t want to engage actual changes to our Auras, mostly because I didn’t think I’d do well.
HOWEVER, having read through this entire Paladin discussion, including how designers treated the Paladin class since WoW’s first launch…I’m ready to throw a few new Aura ideas out there. I tend to dislike making concepts too powerful, because I don’t want to go overboard or seem entirely hack and slash. In this case though, Blizzard owes us for putting up with all this.
The concepts I’ve posted yesterday focus specifically on class fantasy; I’m not an M+ player. In the Summary area below, are the Auras I’ve come up with. The italicized portion in the description is the personal effect for your Paladin while your Aura is active.
Summary
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Retribution Aura: Everyone sharing your Aura gains 5% Critical Damage. *Your Holy and Radiant attack critical hits immediately follow up with a Holy Strike for 10% of the same damage (cannot chain off itself). *
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Crusader Aura: Everyone sharing your Aura gains 10% moving speed, 20% when mounted. *Every second Crusader Strike charges you forward 6yds and has a 15% chance to trigger once more on the same target, for 75% normal damage. *
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Devotion Aura: Everyone shares their Racial Magic Resistance modifier with each party member, adding +4% to it and to Versatility. If a race does not have a Racial Magic Resistance modifier, they share an additional point of Versatility. *Your Paladin gains +5% Block and damage reduction. *
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Concentration Aura: Interrupt, Silence and Fear effects are 30% shorter on those who share your Aura. *Enemies entering or within your Consecration are prevented from causing critical effects for 4 seconds. *
The following is my concept for a new Aura, for Justiciars, more physically oriented Paladins.
- Justiciar Aura: Everyone sharing your Aura gains a chance to Parry equal to your Block or Dodge (whichever is higher). *When you successfully Parry, you immediately riposte with a blessed silver blade, returning 5% unmitigated damage of the Parried attack back on the target. *
The rest of my conceptual Paladin rebuild works around our Auras defining our Consecrations, Seals, and personal buffs we’d receive during Forbearance. It’s a shameless plug, I know, apologies for that. My thread post is lengthy, but only because I wanted to be thorough. I would really appreciate some criticism from anyone who’s read through it!
4 Likes
Great post. Added to OP.
1 Like
All Paladin posters are welcome here. Including those who disagree with me. I frequently upvote posts that I disagree with if they are well written 
I wish one of our Aura would work similar to bramble or Earthen wall totem. (Reduce direct dmg taken by X) I think it would be quite nice for Holy or even Prot
2 Likes