Would the draenei just hate other draenei warlocks more? In which case… we have already heard that story.
Either way it leads to being excluded from society, how much one hates someone else is absolutely redundant. The draenei also would not just kill a draenei warlock.
As I said, the thought proces here is incredibly illogical. You are asking for a story that we already know, regardless of what level of hate you try to argue that the draenei would hold.
They don’t like warlocks, they want warlocks to not use their powers. The story has been told, we know this already, we don’t need additional story about it - it is absolutely redundant.
We would only need a story, if it was physically impossible for someone to become a warlock, but that is not Warcraft, such a thing does not exist in Warcraft. Anyone can become anything, our player characters more than any other - our characters are adventurers, oddities, characters that experience a lot of different things, a lot of different powers, a lot of different people with different powers.
Our characters should be able to diverge from any monoliths regardless. It is up to us to make that decision, not blizzard. What blizzard does with the NPCs is their problem, just like when they said that they would only give the golden eyes to blood elf paladins and priests, because that is what made sense for lore, but they are not withholding that customization option from any other blood elf-class combo.
Blizzard is fully capable of saying: “We do this for our NPCs, because that fits with lore” my line of thought is that they do the same here. NPCs do not like warlocks, good… our characters can be warlocks, and generally warlocks do not care… so the opinion of the NPCs are not worth considering.
Sure as hell wouldn’t be stronger than with Orcs, yet they’re A-OK with Warlocks infesting the ranks and even chill with calling one the ‘Champion of the Horde’.
Repeat after me: It is okay for the PC to be a pioneer in a field. We don’t have to perpetually tread paths already laid by NPCs. We don’t have to live in the shadows of Thrall or Jaina or Anduin or Baine.
Weird, 'cause everyone got real cool with Monks in, what was it, a week of Ji and Aysa showing up? Or, wait, was a person of one race teaching people of other races their class? MY GOD, THE LORE’S BEEN BROKEN SINCE MOP!
‘I’m the PC’ fits. Plus, nothing in-world is actually changing, because the PC is one single entity. I am not a unit from the RTS, I am not a balancing issue waiting to be solved. If you want every Draenei to be stamped out the exact same as the other, go play the RTS.
Oh what garbage. Every DK should have been kill-on-sight for stepping within 30 miles of Stormwind, same as why the Forsaken and Stormwind maintain hostilities (or did, anyway) to this day, because they’re DEATH KNIGHTS of the SCOURGE. Yet day one your DK goes ‘hey I’m here’ and Stormwind’s leadership was like ‘oh cool, you’re a PC so that checks out’. Same deal with DHs. Same deal with Forsaken in general.
Again, your singular character is neither the vanguard of their culture nor an indicator of its health. Just because Tauren can be mages doesn’t mean Thunder Bluff is going to levitate in the air and float about. All it means is that a Tauren might be curious enough to go to wizard college. Just like a Draenei might be desperate enough to take up a pact instead of dying. Which, if you paid attention in Shadowlands, was really bad.
I don’t need my DM to write out my character’s life story, I need my DM to provide a world for my character to adventure in. I’ll handle the character side of things, please and thank you.
Yet another generalization italicized. You know I’m going to needle you on this every single time right? You’re still being a hypocrite.
By the way, if you accept that garbage explanation of ‘Draenei just hate demons harder’ then it’s beyond stupid that they’re willing to associate at all with races that don’t. Like Gnomes. Or Humans. Or Night Elves.
If they ARE willing to overlook the whole demon-pact thing for the sake of relationships, then individuals might be willing to overlook the threat of punishment for the sake of surviving whatever crisis drives them to the pact in the first place.
I’m arguing for less spoon-feeding. I don’t need my character’s motivations made for me, I’ll make those up as I go along, thanks.
Arguably. But not objectively. And it doesn’t matter how taboo it is. It could be 9209 u294qy743173981y39870-43 taboo points and SOMEONE will still break that taboo.
Thrall is a shaman, Jaina is a mage, Anduin is a priest who’s actually a paladin but blizzard calls him a priest despite the fact that he is a paladin ine verything but name. What is baine? is he a warrior?
And even that’s not true. Not even cults have 100% adherence especially among larger ones. While they do a bunch of emotional and psychological manipulations there is STILL outliers STILL people who manage to escape. I would argue Draenei culture is not so monolithic as cults generally are. While they were reluctant to they accepted shamanism in their rank and culture. While I don’t expect them to accept warlocks I don’t think they torture their own people to such a degree that they automatically self-police thought crimes. Once again even if they did it’s still possible for some to escape.
Also if Draenei culture was that oppressive it would be objectively bad. It’s not just warlockism that would be banned but thinking or believing in literally anything besides what they’re taught. I don’t think Draenei would be able to exist as part of the alliance if they were a cult or in the very least wouldn’t allow fraternization with other alliance members as that would allow connections and thus an escape from the cult which makes the punishment of excommunication less damning.
Real cults isolate people from other cultures and people outside their cults as much as humanely possible.
Also Velen was willing to expand his world view to extent to believing Elune was either a Naaru or related to one. While Tyrande was not. Velen was also able to welcome his son back if he forsook the legion. Velen forgave Illidan for killing one of his gods. Meanwhile night elves are nature orientated and been friends with Tauren and furbolg for millennia and has never culturally picked up shamanism. It feels like Draenei culture is more flexible and adaptable than Night Elven. I mean Night elves banished mage and arcane magic for 10,000 years and there was an assassination attempt on tyrande when she legalized it again and welcomed home dire maul night elves.
Night elves also have demon hunters. Which are outliers rather than part of their culture but there is little cultural difference between being a demon hunter and warlock even if what they do with the powers of the legion are radically different. They’re both seen as using forbidden and evil magics. Demon hunters may not summon/enslave demons but they vore a demon soul. They are hated and distrusted but valued for their usefulness nonetheless such as when tyrande released Illidan in Wc3.
Night elves clearly aren’t a cultural monolith, but they seem to be more of one than even Draenei.
I’d say night elves have an equal reason to hate demons as draenei do. They went so far as to ban arcane magic which summoned the legion. The Draenei did the same thing but never banned arcane magic even lightforged have mages.
Look, you ghosted me last time so we might as well continue where we left off.
Also, on an unrelated note, why do you and Velaethia have identical battle pets?
Don’t worry fellow Warlocks, once Mechagnomes get druids and Velfs get paladins, they’ll forget about you, LFD, dabbling into some fel magic for the greater good.
Lightforged warlocks are an abomination and should never happen.
Having said that, ive been playing with one on the PTR and they feel really good. So im looking forward for when it goes live. Gonna level one up and get their heritage armor.
I suppose the strike from Turalyon was in jest, then?
Illidan lived because he was too strong to kill, not out of some misplaced tolerance. He walked in, disenchanted their god, no-sold a strike from their commander, and went on to have a jolly good time fighting Sargeras indefinitely.
Any one of these feats puts him far and beyond the capabilities of a lightforged to handle.
Any warlock showing up in their ranks is likely gonna have to pull the same thing, and be capable of killing their way out of the metaphorical lions den. doubly so now that they aren’t allies of convenience.
I’m not interested in treating the same account as different people if possible, as a general preference.
I should’ve clarified. No LFD tried to kill him. Velen didn’t try to kill him.
They didn’t even ask or demand he leave. Turalyon made a single instinctual strike than everybody is buddies again.
Personally if someone killed my god I’d at least ask them to leave the premises.
Then again if my god tried to force themselves on someone they wouldn’t be my god so.
The idea of individual versus different people is irrelevant. Target the discussion. Shouldn’t be treating anyone in here differently anyways to be perfectly honest.
So believe what you want, or don’t. It’s not relevant to the conversation.
Turalyon, is however, pretty famously lightforged, which would be the defining feature separating Lightforged Draenei from just Draenei. He’s also their faction leader. Saying it wasn’t explicitly a LFD, but just their supreme commander aiming for Illidans head doesn’t quite ring the same.
Velen hasn’t done much killing at all, tbh. IIRC it was a significant event when he decided to confront and actually kill his buddy that betrayed him on Argus.
Leave where, out the airlock?. The only way Illidan was taking an early exit was voluntarily, which is not in their means to do.
I’ve interacted with both characters independently on this thread. if i can consolidate the separate replies under one entity, it’s easier to handle on my end.
If they can Lightforged a Dreadlord against their will, an Eredar hardly seems improbable. Wouldn’t be shocked if some Eredar looking to come back into the fold had to be Lightforged to prove their sincerity or something.