I mean, we’re not going to agree. That’s obvious. I think you’re dead wrong. You think I’m dead wrong. We’re at an impasse. We always have been. I contend that the rating change has no impact at the top and no real impact at the bottom and for the fraction of a fraction of the players hardstuck at 1800 they will probably get an equivalent or superior weapon by the time they could’ve purchased the Glad one anyway. The reaction to the change is disproportionate to the number of people effected. Participation will plummet, we agree. But it’s for the wrong reasons. Baddies that were NEVER going to get a weapon are quitting arena because the rating is too high for them? It’s hilarious.
But it doesn’t matter, anyway. As long as there are a couple hundred teams across North America arena will be just fine. If these changes scare off 10,000 of the 15,000 prospective arena players, we still have TWICE as many as any private server and those pserver brackets were banging.
If certain kinds of people play, it affects what the top will be. Its the difference between a rating distribution of 1200-3000 or a rating distribution of 1400-2200. The argument is that even Gladiators might not hit 2050.
Yeah and the argument is dumb. You get more points for winning than losing against the same mmr.
Enough people will play for mmr to work. In so enough will play to hit 2700 or whatever number you wanna put that’s absurdly higher than all the rating requirements. I do not understand why people who don’t know how the systems work to argue about it.
Pservers had old TBC arena rules and infinite duration seasons. This meant that people could get their gear no matter what.
It does. If the lowest rated players, the lower rated players, the low rated players, the average players don’t play…
Then the ratings of the remaining players fall significantly. A bracket only gets bloated if players of vastly variant skill levels participate in an arena season that is very long.
What does that even mean. Certain kinds of people. Idc if literally every person playing had never been 2k or 1800. Over time they will some hit high, high ratings.
Left out here is the 80th to 97th percentile arena participants. These players would easily get weapons in a reasonable amount of time. But with S4 requirements, they won’t get them at all. How long before they quit?
Actually this is the argument. It doesn’t matter if enough people play, it matters that an even distribution of skill levels are playing for MMR to work.
If 4% of the players of average or lower rating play…
And 50% of the players of a higher rating don’t play…
and 100% of players of the highest rating play…
Yes they will? 2000 rated players will get that weapon regardless of the change. 1400 rated players were never getting it in a reasonable time frame. This change only really hurts the hardstuck 1800 players. And those are, statistically, less than 6% of the arena ladder. And since only 4-6% of WoW players, again statistically, engage in arena, we’re talking 6% of 4% of players being impacted.
That’s like 0.24% of players being effected by the change.
→
Nope. Wrong. Numbers don’t matter. Again. Wins will be more than losses. Take that logic and apply it to 1000 1500xp players. If you win half your games which you would going against the same competition, you still be getting more than 1500cr. The ones who win the most get the gear and gradually increase the gap. Eventually even 1500 players have the best gear because they had to beat someone.
You’re missing my point. You have been the whole time.
We agree that these changes are going to essentially collapse arena participation and ruin the game modality for most prospective players.
We disagree that this is a PEOPLE problem and not a RATING problem.
The exact same people that are now not going to play arena because of the 2050 rating change to weapons WERE NEVER GETTING THEM ANYWAY. It’s not the rating requirement that is going to kill participation. It’s dumb people. It’s people that are not, realistically, impacted by the change quitting because of the change. That’s the problem, in its entirety. PEOPLE are going to ruin TBC arena, not Blizzard.
I used the gasoline analogy earlier because it’s perfectly apt. We don’t have a fuel shortage… we have a stupidity excess.
If its 1000 players 1500 xp, then you’ll end up with a distribution around 1300-1800.
If its 1000 players 2000 xp, you’ll end up with a distribution around 1300-1800.
If its 1000 players 2500 xp, you’ll end up with a distribution around 1300-1800.
If its 1000 players 3000 xp, you’ll end up with a distribution around 1300-1800.
You don’t understand the basics of how ELO and MMR works.
It is a people problem BECAUSE it is a rating problem. If people aren’t incentivized to play because there are no rewards, then you will have a lack of participation.
You can’t blame them either, raids would be a ghost town if they weren’t rewarding.
They were never going to get the rewards. Freakin’ “Ted” has never been above 1400 rating in his life. He sees the 2050 weapon rating requirement and goes “Screw that, I’m not going to play!”. Ted was never getting a weapon. Ted might respond "Well, I thought I could maybe get one before and now I KNOW that I can’t". Which is dumb. Ted was never getting that weapon. Before it wasn’t obvious to him, because he’s dumb. Now it is obvious for him because it’s written right out in simple letters; 2050.
People like my fictional Ted are going to collapse the MMR pyramid. Morons that are not actually impacted by the change quitting because of the change. That is not a Blizzard problem, that’s a Ted problem.
Under the old system they could. In fact they would get S2 weapon by saving throughout season 1. Now they aren’t even gonna stockpile and we will have the same problem on retail.
You just keep agreeing with me.
Rating system in place —> Players don’t play —> System collapses
Rating system not on place —> Players play —> System doesn’t collapse
Solution? Kill the rating system for Season 1 and drastically lower it for Season 2.