No, because the playstyle wasn’t exclusive to ICC, and even with Shadowmourne applying blood plague was a dps increase on top of having Shadowmourne. That’s why Shadowmourne was irrelevant to the point being made, and I brought up that video in case people wanted to see a dk in Wrath playing without blood plague. That was it and you created a strawman argument out of the whole thing.
Oh, I’ll edit something else in here. It wasn’t exclusive to 2h either. This was brought up because you kept saying 2h playstyle to talk about how the spec just normally played and you didn’t worry about km procs.
Listen, you lead us down here. I thought this was just going to be a healthy debate on why MotFW should or shouldn’t come back. You’re the one who started throwing all these sub playstyles at us. If you had not mentioned Shadowmourne I probably wouldn’t have went down this rabbit hole. Your evidence on this playstyle was a PvP video that involved Shadowmourne. Which you still haven’t presented to the class.
Yeah and I have already gone back and said you were right about the “original” playstyle in Cata. You brought up a playstyle that happened in Wrath that involved a 2H.
Can we just move on and think of ways to make 2H and DW gap closer instead of focusing on things from the past that I, myself, have already said doesn’t matter anymore. Shadowlands is a new game. We have Blizzard’s ear to fix the concerns of the past.
No, if you would have actually read you wouldn’t have gone down this rabbit hole.
You even tried to insult me but you did the exact thing you accused me of.
MoTFW shouldn’t come back, at first it was just a % melee increase and it didn’t work out, then it split the spec and dragged the entire spec down. What else is there to discuss about MotFW? Having obliterate get a damage boost from 2h meant you could never buff up obliterate for DW which could have prevented the Howling Blast spam. Buff obliterate for DW and it buffs for 2h as well. The same goes for frost strike during the MoP/WoD era.
I did read your rant about a playstyle. It was confusing to the topic and if you were more clear, then perhaps we could have moved on from it.
Because you were ignoring what I was saying and creating your own head cannon on what I was actually saying.
See, that’s all I need to hear. I understand your concerns. Perhaps there is a better solution than MotFW.
Now. What about off-hand proc chance? Should 2H get a passive that double boosts KM procs or do you have another idea? I would love to see your view on this.
I don’t see how I could have been any more clear. I explained it multiple times.
No, again, you said specific statements, I called them out, and you had to clarify. No reading comprehension failure going on.
Km is applied to both exactly the same. It looks like 1st auto crit has a 30% chance to proc, and that proc goes to 60% chance on the next crit if it doesn’t proc, then 90% then 100%. 2h just does not attack fast and why it’s a bad choice for an auto centric spec. Not only do both weapons proc km for DW, they both work with runic attenuation, frozen pulse, whatever the talent is where autos provide a shield. If you do take away the offhand interaction then what’s the point?
This is exactly why an entire rework would need to be done to design a spec for both weapons. This exact scenario that is happening on alpha should have been easy to spot from a mile away.
Yeah and it still doesn’t mean anything to the overall conversation.
Ah, no. I said the same statements the entire time, they never changed. I relinked the statements over and over. I linked your statement, then I linked my statement. You only saw what you wanted to see. That is not a failure on my end.
To slow down the amount of procs that DWing got compared to 2H. So the weapon speed of a 1H is 2.6, while 2H is 3.6. So if I understand the calculations right, your first auto crit with your main hand has a 30% chance to proc KM. If that fails, your off-hand crit hits has a 60% chance to proc. By the time that interaction happens, 2H will be coming off of its first attack. Thus the next swing of a 2H, if it missed the proc, would have a 60% chance. DW would already have gone through this rotation twice by the time 2H got one proc.
However, if the off-hand wasn’t allowed to proc KM then it would be on a level playing field. A main handed attack has a 30% chance to proc KM, then so on and so forth. The disparity of 2H getting 22 procs and DW getting 88 in a 12 minute fight, is lessened down to 2H 22 procs and DW 30~ procs.
Of course you are right, we would need to increase the chances of Runic Attenuation, Frozen Pulse and Permafrost.
Agreed. Increasing the amount of runic power on autos for Runic Attenuation is okay to do. Frozen Pulse would either need the damage increased or be changed. Same with Permafrost. These are things to consider.
No, you didn’t. That’s why I called out those statements.
Uh, no. That is not at all what I said about how KM procs work. It looks like you don’t know how you get KM to proc. Go read The Killing Machine tooltip and come back. It’s pointless to go forward until then.
So does each weapon have it’s own safety net? So your main hand crits has a 30% chance to proc KM and so on. While your off-hand has the same chance to start with?
Main hand and off hand are irrelevant. It’s just auto attack crits. First auto attack crit is a 30% chance, if that doesn’t proc the next auto attack crit is 60%, the next one if that doesn’t crit has 90% and then it goes to guaranteed after that. 2h just doesn’t have as many autos, and thus it doesn’t have as many auto crits which is why DW has 277% more km procs than 2h.
iirc they share the same bad luck proc protection. basically every crit auto it checks for a proc. say roughly 20% chance to proc to start (not the actual numbers im just using them as an example). if it fails the roll the next chance is boosted to 40% and so on. dual wield autos significantly more often due to swing speed + 2 weapons thus the disparity in km procs. there was a very long discussion on km alone in another thread which basically came down to 2h requiring close to a 100% crit modifier if i remember right for it to average out to dual wields proc rate.
So could they not just change KM to have some sort of MotFW passive? Say like, your crit autos have a 30% chance to trigger KM and 2H has a 60% chance? Perhaps not those numbers but KM have a double chance to proc for 2H. Would that sort out the issue or would it make 2H more favorable than DW?
wouldn’t do much of anything but at best increase 2h procs from a little less than 2 per minute while DW was getting a little over 7 per minute, to like 4 procs per minute since you are starting on the second stage of back luck protection. It’s just a band aid. You still would need more crit and haste, and at that point just use DW.
2h is not a good choice for procs based off of auto attacks.
More trolling huh? That’s all you ever do on here. So if I’m actually taking part whether or not people like what I’m saying and people are telling others to ignore me, then what should they do with someone like you? Hmm?
Well they can just read their posts and decide for themselves. When the village idiot exposes themselves, can just ignore what they say or toy with them and watch them continually regurgitate garbage and offer zero evidence other than vague asides.
