in my experience, the people at the upper end of the range are neither the toxic ragers nor the people who leave after one missed kick
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So if I were the leader of the group and I wanted to bypass all that…I could just kick someone? They’d get the debuff and we’d be free to leave.
They’ve talked about this in the past and it’s hard to punish people because there’s so many reasons any individual person might leave.
Is DPS super low? Are people dying to easily avoidable mechanics etc. The list goes on.
If someone thinks they’ll waste their time and potentially not finish and spend over an hour in there, they don’t have to stay.
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Well then come up with an idea to prevent that from happening. I see the problem you addressed, but I don’t see the solution. I at least came up with ideas to work with.
There isn’t a solution because it isn’t a real problem. If you’re being quit on so often that this is a serious issue…I’m sorry to say that the problem is you.
These threads get made once in a while and no one has ever come up with something that wouldn’t be abused to a ridiculous degree.
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So an arrogant player A keeps doing mechanics badly and you call them out on it in a polite manner and they take offense to it because they are on the spectrum and rage quit on you at the second last boss isn’t somethin that could ever happen?
Why are you chatting during a run? If people keep quitting on you so often that this has become a serious issue for you, and it sounds like it has, stop talking during your runs. All you need to say is hello, ready, and good game. That’s it.
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There’s no way to punish leavers that isn’t also digital slavery.
What if I get into a group and it becomes obvious the group cannot time the key? Well, my time commitment is now growing beyond what I agreed to. If I agree to a 30 minute key, and it becomes clear that key is now going to take 1+ hours AND now my only reward is off the table, should I be forced to stay and carry these people?
No. Of course not.
Look, there’s and unspoken social contract when you pug content that you can actually fail. Everyone tried their best, and if that’s not good enough, we call it. There’s no reason to keep pounding something that isn’t going to happen.
Now, I get it, at this stage of the season, most people who don’t do m+ can probably eventually work their way through a key for the vault. That’s great. Make groups for that. But don’t try and trap people who actually do m+ In these groups because you can’t be bothered to set expectations.
It’s premade for a reason.
What exactly are you going on about? You are acting so immature like this stuff couldn’t possibly happen to anyone or be a factor in anything because it doesn’t happen to you.
It happened and when the tank is continually failing at doing mechanics in a 13…then something needs to be said if it is causing wipes on the other members because of their failing.
your lack of communication leads me to believe you run with a core group of friends in VOIP or the familiarity helps you succeed but gives you a narrow mind on the struggles of pugging it.
I’ve pugged high keys, low keys, and everything in between. Of course people quit sometimes, but if you’re setting up your groups correctly and not being an idiot in the chat, it won’t be a regular occurrence.
No, he’s right. For most people who m+, that’s all the chatting that required. We’ve all run every one of these dungeons 100+ times. There’s no discussion needed. There’s maybe a couple of options here or there, like “do we skip the casters before the bridge or do them?” kinda thing. One or two in one or two dungeons. Other than that, everyone knows what’s up.
If the tank is failing mechanics and causes a wipe, there’s breakpoints for that. 20 minutes before Amarth? Dead key. Hakkar at 11 minutes? Dead key. Etc etc.
But neither of you or Pisaro have considered the other case. That you are not failing on time at all and the run is going quite smoothly regardless of deaths. but you’re at the breaking point where if this were to continue it WILL have an affect on the group and the timer.
So you say “Hey tank, could you try not to point the cleaves on the melee suddenly? It’s been killing us because you’re abruptly moving it into us.”
Then the tank throws a fit and quits the group because they can’t see they’ve been killing the group on a storming week turning cleaving mobs suddenly on the melee to avoid a tornado. Leaving the group as a whole out in the water when all they had to do was finish the run and take into consideration the next time they play to change their approach on tanking this week.
I’m not the bad guy here and at least I can see your side of the story. I have yet to see either of you take into consideration the alternatives.
I’ve had the torghast layers unlocked for so long that I forgot you had to work through them.
Yeah that would work. I think that ‘clearing a level’ for a given keystone level should be a timed run instead of completion. If completion was the only requirement to be able to unlock a key level, there would definitely be groups of players spending hours trying to clear keys, which I think is a bad player experience.
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Well, I think that’s enough internet for me for today.
There is no alternative. Some keys just won’t be timed and only the ones that will go significantly over the timer will be quit on. You just can’t force people to stay in a bad group. Whatever solution you can come up with will just be abused.
If you want people to quit less often, spend a little more time and build your groups a little bit better. You need to take some responsibility too.
I’m just saying in general, I’m 90% or more of runs, communication beyond a few words is not necessary.
I’m this example, I consider it a given that if someone has to correct a behavior, the key is over. Like “that needs to be kicked” while running back from a surge in gambit. Someone will probably leave the group. Nobody likes getting called out, and the chances that a rando is an immature man-child are pretty decent.
And it does come down to maturity. People who rage quit keys because someone reminds them to not stand in the slime AND the people who want to have players chained to their desk so they can get their gear reward. These people are equally immature. “My bad” is all that it takes, a little civility.
Personally, no matter who’s fault it is, I always think what could I have done to save that. Could I have kited better? Backed off when the cleave is coming? It’s a dps loss, obviously, but if it saves a death, it’s worth it.
But at the end of the day, setting expectations before the run is key. During the run is the wrong time to be having these conversations.
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I just make a personal blacklist and share it with all my friends. 
Bet this is the OP 100%
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This is everyone who complains about leavers. If it’s happening to your groups so often that it warrants complaint, then guess what the problem is? Yeah man.
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I have had one leaver myself this season. DK tank that forgot what the affixes were and pulled the whole first hall on SD 16 on the first week lol