Actually, a lot of people are getting bored of it. It becomes the center of your rotation. You come closer to being like a Ret paladin pumping everything into one ability. I went with Night Fae, and more than happy with the flow of my spec. Ancient Aftershock is a lot of fun, as is Spear of Bastion. To say Condemn is saving arms is absolutely false.
While the animation is great, I would hope it’s only a glyph for execute after the expac.
I can understand not liking it for that reason, and some of the other covenant abilities are good for aoe. So that can make sense as a choice.
Condemn is an awesome ability in itself, imho, but then I’ve always liked Fury more than Arms, and found Arms to be boring. If players who prefer Arms are happy with the spec, then ok.
Prot needs the most work, imho. And I think that Ignore Pain should be the focus of any changes.
Prot gameplay shouldn’t revolve around repeatedly casting an annoying, ineffective ability. There’s not much reason for it that I can see. Just give Ignore Pain a short cooldown and make it more powerful. Then Revenge could be used more frequently as a rage dump.
Both abilities would need some adjustments for that to work, but I think the overall dynamic of the spec would be better.
Prot is definitely weak and so is Fury.
But Arms is certainly not in “dark times” if you’re interested in DPS 
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How.
You’re saying all this, but how is it not. You dump rage for a shield. The shield is not intended to be strong.
Satisfying is a rather useless term. It’s so subjective at to be meaningless.
This still does not make sense.
Rewording without explaining does not help make your statement more understandable.
Are you referring to condemn being such a large part of venthyr warrior’s damage? That’s intentional, and not limited to condemn.
Are you saying that arms needs to take venthyr to do effective damage? That is also incorrect.
Hence, rather than presume you a fool, I stated that I did not understand. In the hope that you could help me understand.
You still have not provided anything to back this statement.
I don’t need to.
You can see for yourself in the highest performing people in the game currently for M+ and raiding.
There are little to no prot warriors in those aspects for a reason. Prot is weak.
World first didnt have a prot warrior at all.
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You look adorable in that santa hat.
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Thank you, its quite small but it fits.
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Prot gameplay currently revolves almost entirely around generating rage to repeatedly cast a weak absorb shield.
A little rage is spent on shield block, but ignore pain is the main focus. Revenge is only cast if it’s free.
There’s no reason for the spec to work that way.
Ignore Pain could have a short cooldown, maybe 10-12 seconds, and simply be a stronger ability. This would mean that some rage could be spent on revenge, an offensive ability, rather than spamming a weak absorb over and over.
It’s subjective, but it’s not meaningless. When a spec has a generate/spend mechanic, which Prot does, the main spender should feel awesome to cast, because you are spending the rest of the time generating resources for that purpose.
For example, Chaos Bolt is an awesome spender because you are chucking huge fel meteors at your target.
Ignore Pain is barely noticeable, and Prot Warrior casts it over and over. That makes it a bad resource spender. A reworked revenge could be a lot better, as it is an offensive ability that hits multiple targets.
As others have noted, if you have condemn, it’s massively important, your playstyle revolves around it. Moreso than would be the case for any single ability otherwise.
This is not necessarily bad. I like the ability a lot. But some players might see it as bad, as some comments indicate even in this thread.
Therefore, as I said originally, I can understand thinking that the ability ends up being too important to how the spec works, even though I personally like the ability.
Well, no. If you need more mitigation, you use IP. If you want more damage, you use Revenge.
If you’re not in dire straights, there’s no reason to not use rage on revenge. Damage is typically more important.
Why?
it’s not the main spender, it’s only an option to spend. This is not comparable to say, fury, where the entire spec is designed around pressing that one button. Prot has choices in this regard. There’s execute, IP, revenge, SB.
I cannot agree with this sentiment.
Taking condemn modifies execute, instead of adding a new ability. It also pushes the spec to take talents and conduits that specifically accentuate the execute ability.
If you take a different conduit, but give it the same treatment, you see a comparable spike in execute’s output. All condemn does is push that build from viable, to optimal.
Whereas on the other hand, other covenants (NF and Kyrian) add a new ability, which has to stand on it’s own, and part of their damage is through rage generation, which shows through other abilities.
The idea that condemn does too much damage is born or a lack of knowledge or understanding.
Chaos bolt is also the only spender the spec has in st scenarios. You would only cast RoF, for example, when there are over 3 targets. 6 if havoc is available.
(and even then, it’s not uncommon to simply ignore RoF regardless)
If a player is tanking anything difficult for their level of progression, then rage is spent on ignore pain for mitigation.
Even assuming that a particular player does everything correctly, it’s bad gameplay, and it’s also a big part of why prot is not a good tank.
Adjusting this dynamic would improve the playstyle of the spec while also making prot a more competitive tank in a lot of situations.
If you have Condemn as an Arms warrior, it is more important to the spec’s gameplay than any single ability would otherwise be.
Which could be seen as good or bad by different players.
Nobody said anything about the ability doing “too much damage,” or any such thing.
This is not correct.
Watch top tanks raid. Even while actively tanking the boss, they will use revenge instead of IP at times. If you don’t need the survivability, there is no reason to not do some damage.
But prot is a good tank. Full stop.
I have no doubt that this is technically true, since a top level player would want to eek out a little extra damage whenever possible, but that’s not particularly relevant.
If anything, it tends to confirm the point I am making, which is that Revenge would be a better primary rage spender than Ignore Pain.
Frequently casting a weak absorb shield is a bad mechanic for the spec.
Yes, sure, mixing in an extra Revenge occasionally makes sense, but that is beside the point.
I mean, if you actually check the logs he linked every class underneath Arms warrior has a viable spec which actually ranks much higher, the main problem is if you are set on playing warrior you are accepting an unescapable handicap despite how skilled you on, when comparing the best to the best and worst to the worst respectively, if other classes decide to play classes worst then Arms then that is their prerogative although they’re consciously making that decision, warriors on the other hand, don’t get the luxury of that choice…
Yeah, for now. The point is that this isn’t going to be forever. So all the doom posting isn’t helping anything except to perpetuate a state of panic that warriors are useless.
Middle of the pack is fine. For now we’re not top tier. Balance happens. Its going to be fine.
And for most players skill level. It doesn’t matter anyway.
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Most important thing you can do on the warrior forums is ignore Derez, just a troll.
Warriors are bad right now outside of Arms. With that being said, you still would only bring 1 to a raid and for M+ you would never invite one.
People are gonna be like OMG THO YOU CAN INTERVENE A TANK AND RALLYING CRY. Gtfo out of here with that crap. Warriors are the only melee class without a baseline stun, we offer NO real CC or good utility in any way and our damage is sub par.
You would never bring a Warrior to a M+ if you can get any other melee class, they all do the same damage or more and offer way more for the run.
SO in a raid lets take 1 warrior.
M+ lets never take them because i can just take a rogue or dh or monk or shaman or pally or death knight, or just take more ranged. THEY ARE ALL BETTER CHOICES.
Anyone on here who is arguing that Warriors are “okay” and we need to just wait they will be better in the end of the expansion. Needs a brain check asap.
My advice to you or any Warrior who understands the struggle is real. DO NOT DEPEND on Blizzard making the correct tuning. Re roll if you havent already.
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It’s really considerate of you to put the, “I have nothing important to say, just ignore this” before the long post. Thanks.
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So this would be a bad time to tell you about a Fury warrior pushing 16 - 17 keys?
Warrior could use a buff for sure. Nothing major, as that would make us OP as heck. I agree that people that think Warriors scale better than any other class are silly. Though, those that say the warrior class is the reason their performance is bad, are also silly.
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Discuss! What’s this telling me Derez? Good sample? I dislike how arms is bottom of the bis spec but thank gsh its closer to avg margin. It could use something idk what but id prefer them to leave it as pvp its just too much to mess with. Imo they really gotta balance fury out vs arms and im sure they’ll be changes eventually for pve.
Ima get my own log after tonight, thank you so much for the recommendation to massacre ^^
====> Regarding Fury Looking at it further: minus one spec for mage, hunter, rogue;all three specializions of each class are much stronger also being two of their specs of the same mage, hunter, rogue that also perform better… Freaking blows… 405 fury warriors lulz