Highborne who rebelled against Azshara. If you are going to talk about this, know the lore. Eldre’Thalas was under siege by the Legion the entirety of the War, and was defended by Goldrinn.
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Like 3 or 5 that were allowed to come back after Cata and who were exclusive to Eldre Thalas.
That, again, is the same as before. A kaldorei who served Azshara. Or are you pretending that Eldre’thalas was never part of the Kaldorei Empire…
the lengths people will go… as if Eldre’thalas was never a part of Azshara’s Kaldorei Empire.
Using your own words for convince.
There were kaldorei who fought for Azshara as well. You seem to suggest the kaldorei of today are innocent of what the kaldorei of the past have done, while simultaneously suggesting the Horde is eternally guilty of what the Horde has done. I disagree. Both are guilty of actions attributed to them.
Azshara had tons of kaldorei by her side to begin with. Malfurion didn’t even bother to challenge that mad kaldorei woman in some honor duel. He just sunk her with his might.
He may need to do it again to the next mad kaldorei broad.
Yeah, no, Malfurion and co. stopped following Azshara once they realized what she had done. Mages were exiled and most of her supporters were killed.
The Horde followed Sylvanas for months and months AFTER she had committed a genocide. The two are in no way comparable.
The Kaldorei who supported Azshara are mostly Naga, blood elves or Nightborne now. It also happened 10 000 years ago when both the Alliance and Horde weren’t even a thought.
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In the interest of fairness I think there is something that I need to correct in regards to Arthas.
After some research it seems that the Alliance of Lorderon was still a faction during the plauge. Stormwind, KT, and possibly Dalaran were still in it. Arthas in the plaugelands I would say was acting as an agent of Lorderon and the Alliance and the plauge was raging through the Alliance lands.
But that is a weak claim because the horde did infact burn Teldrassil.
The only Kaldorei that fought for Azshara was Varo’then when he killed Lord Ravencrest. The demon armies fought. Those that sunk with her were the Zin’azshari Highborne.
Well of course, she was queen!
What?
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And they are Naga
Yes
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Mostly, you say. That seems spawned from head canon. Especially considering the dead. Many kaldorei died before they defeated Azshara and cast out the Queldorei. Many kaldorei died serving Azshara before she was defeated.
There were many honest kaldorei who died supporting Azshara. Same as honest Horde supporting Sylvanas. There is no difference.
Fortunately, the OP did not limit the discussion as such. Not some time frame that favors an argument…
He stated crimes done by the races. Not simply Alliance and Horde - which are groupings of the races that caused such turmoil.
The Sundering was done by the Kaldorei Empire under their Queen. With the backing of her kaldorei subjects. I chuckle when I see Alliance apologists try to squirm their way out of that while crying about the Horde.
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It’s not. Those who kept following Azshara were turned into Naga. Those who refused to give up magic (Highborne, which the majority supported Azshara) were exiled and became Blood Elves.
I’m not even sure what you’re trying to prove at this point to be honest. Any time I see your posts, you’re trying to get a gotcha moment on some Alliance poster or posting the edgiest take imaginable. Blaming current Night Elves who literally fought against the Legion and Azshara for what she and her highborne did is just extremely silly.
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You realize how he keeps on whits rediculous (and even wrong) whataboutism just to derail the focus?
It is just complete and utter nonsense what cursewords says and he knows it.
He has been debunked several times and just keeps on and on till someone else falls for it.
It still is wrong what ever he says, a typical horde apologist nothing more, not worth the time.
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I pity your imagination. I think I am quite tame, all things considered.
“Edgiest?” If you say so. People throw that word around… it is trendy… so call me what ever trendy word you will. In my day, an edge was an edge.
Simply telling the truth about the Kaldorei Empire and their Queen has become edgy? I doubt it.
No. It is just a matter of fact. Especially when there are kaldorei who were alive at the time. The kaldorei were on Azshara’s side, and parted ways with her later. Same as the Horde and Sylvanas. That is just how it is.
Sorry for not getting back to you on this! The basic reason is that all of the members that were lead by Gariathros were, and still are members of the Alliance in its current iteration. The dwarves, living Lordaeronean humans, and what have you. I don’t classify all acts of Arthas as under the Alliance’s purview. It’s the same reason I included the call to genocide the orcs under the Blood Elves and Internment camps under the Forsaken. They were the ones to do it.
I do also think that it isn’t unfair to include the Nightborne and Blood Elves under the Azshara umbrella as they were also comprised of the original highborne caste. I also don’t think it’s unfair to include the massive arcane storm under their crimes as well now that I’ve done more research!
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Sigh.
Most Kaldorei immediately sided against the demons and Azshara when they learned what she had done.
The Kaldorei who kept following Azshara were HIGHBORNE. They either became
A. High Elves
B. Naga
Add to that the fact that Night Elves abandoned magic and their very way of life for 10 000 years in order to atone and make sure what happened doesn’t happen again.
Compare this to :
Sylvanas committing genocide - then ALL Horde leaders and soldiers kept fighting for her aside from Saurfang, despite all of them knowing what happened.
The Horde then loses nothing of significant value and no one in the Horde had any consequences of note happen to them (except for Gallywix but no one liked him anyway, he was a piece of crap from day 1) . Sylvanas is only dethroned because she shot herself in the foot by screaming out loud that the Horde ain’t crap.
I don’t know what else to say. If you still believe they’re the same, you do you.
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Incorrect. Most of the Night Elf resistance presumed that the demons were somehow controlling the Queen, and it wasn’t until after the war that it became common knowledge. I also want to reiterate. This is about crimes that were committed, I list out mitigating factors for many points, and no where do I state that the Alliance is worse than the Horde or the Horde is better. I simply am aiming to point out where wrong doing was done.
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Yes, that’s true, however it doesn’t really matter as they still fought against the evil faction. They just didn’t know the Queen was behind it.
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Yeah, but it wasn’t this ‘massive force’ of Night Elves that united the entire race behind them. It was stated to be a sizable, but still outnumbered rebellion in the War of the Ancients, and they were not even rebelling against the queen.
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They had no reason to rebel against her since they did not know she was the mastermind behind the Legion’s arrival.
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Sure. Doesn’t mean they were right to have supported her!
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Most? You minimize how long it took for an effectual amount to change their minds. Many kaldorei fought and died for their Queen’s original scouring of Azeroth.
Well, the kaldorei got 10,000 years after they Sundered Azeroth.
Will the Alliance Apologists give the Horde 10,000 years to be as perfect as the kaldorei became after 10,000 years?
I will start my clock…