Agreed. But you’re equally in dreamtime with me, as Blizzard has never fostered this environment/community. Hard to roll back over a decade of ignoring it, and then placing systems that further the wrong outlook towards our fellow players.
The pendulum will swing back. Soon, I hope. Wouldn’t it be great for guilds to come back in a positive way?
Considering MDI routes are a widely available resource, most runs on a given week are done in basically the same way. The discrepancies in time come from a combination of gear/class/player ability and coordination. The route is the least impactful part of this calculation, unless your tank/group leader just doesn’t know where they’re going.
Agreed, but almost impossible. A large portion of players want even more solo/ queueable content instead.
And that really is the issue. For better or worse the playerbase is so diverse that the feedback from different sides is almost always opposite and contradictory.
Can confirm. The last several “meta” specs we have invited to our 17-18’s did not know the dungeon and nearly got outdps’d by the tank.
The last couple warlocks though… absolute pumpers.
In a twisted way this is correct.
At this point in the patch, the sub-optimal specs will have had to grind the hell out of the game to reach an acceptable IO rating. Meanwhile the meta bois, you don’t know what you’re getting because how many of them have been getting a free ride based on the assumption that a stong class = a good run.
The last couple warlocks though… absolute pumpers.
All three warlock specs are capable of some pretty respectable damage right now. Affliction only suffers in very low keys and low health trash in general, but affliction shreds bosses and high health trash.
Lol ah so we’re going to move the goalposts. HOw far do you want to move them? To just MMORPGS? Okay. WoW is the only one with timed PVE content. WoW does not have more subscribers than the combined playerbase of other MMORPGS. Its struggling to stay ahead of FF14. None of them try to pretend to be an Esport.
Nobody cares about M+ speed running. MDI struggles to get 250k views on youtube. On a channel with over 1.5mil subs. Thats beyond awful clearly shows how little interest wow players have in actual competitive speed running elements in the game. If you lowball Shadowlands current subs you’ll still get over 4mil players. High ball it and we’re near 5mil. So under 250k views for 4million players? Pretty bad.
There was once a time, that people claimed this about hard modes, heroic mode or raiding in general.
Also battlegrounds and arena.
I personally love M+. I don’t view the timer as a speed run. I view it as a test of my ability to make decisions quickly. Maybe it is because I played several sports that also had timer.
But I have never watched an MDI.
Oh good job ignoring the whole post and taking just the smallest thing you can out of context. lol.
Nobody has ever said this about raiding. Raiding is the reason WoW’s been on top for so long. That was its big claims. Same with EBG’s for pvp. Thats the only thing WoW has that other MMORPGs don’t have.
Everybody who played 60 pvp in AV back in vanilla. Remembers it and has all sorts of stupid moments with the tree lord and other things.
lol doesn’t every sport have a timer? Weird flex but okay.
In terms of quickly M+ doesn’t really change. Tank states route. Don’ts tand in bad. Use cc and interupts. Do your 12345 button rotations. Repeat like a robot and if you don’t mess it up. You win.
The thing is, speedrunning isn’t really what mythic + is about. Sure you’re attempting to clear the dungeon as fast as possible - BUT - you’re also upgrading the key each time you do this and making the next run more challenging. The upper limit of mythic plus progression is when the HP values and damage output become so extreme that you can no longer complete the instance within a pre-determined time limit.
If speed running were the true intent of mythic +, MDI would consist of teams running +2s by sprinting to the end and aoeing the whole instance down with mages and boomkins.
Lords, but you must play with a perfect team. I’m doing M+ in the real world… stuff happens that shouldn’t happen! 
How the team recovers from it can be a sight to see. 
Ignorance must be bliss. In reality there were many players that complained that shifting focus to so much instanced content, i.e. raids/ bgs/ arena would kill open world content and be bad for the game.
Coach calls in play. Don’t miss assignments. Block and release. Run route, catch ball. Repeat like a robot. Win Superbowl.
Yeah. That’s how it “works.”
Wut? I don’t think the term speed running applies to easy content as fast as you can. MDI are racing against one another in the same dungeons same everything but what they pick. So idk whats more speed running than competing directly against the other worlds best team for being the fastest and cleanest.
Lol. Open world? What are you on about. WoW since vanilla has always been about instanced content. I have no idea what you’re on about. Unless you’re really out here tryign to make the argument that World quests are the real end game lol.
Remember your comment about how most mmorpgs have no timers? Previous mmorpgs had almost no instanced content.
In reality it was not. They had to scramble to create MC. BGs were not planned and did not come out for almost a year.
I am not. Some players do. There is literally a thread asking for it up now.
Look I might need to take a 20 minute conference call after each boss ok! I have a real life!
So what. EQ? Lmfao. Every current MMO has instanced content. Thats a basic function of them. This strawman is pointless. WoW started with instanced content.
Ah so dungeons don’t exist huh? Lmfao. C’mon. Now.
Lol so your not saying WQ is end game content, but you’re going to use it for some reason to make an argument with misleading information? Good job buddy. Do more mental gymnastics.
My point was that it’s a mix of challenge and speed - you’re competing against another team in real time rather than a preset clock like traditional speed running. It’s the same concept with world firsts - you’re competing against other guilds to see who can kill the bosses in the new raid before anyone else. The difference is the time is generally measured in hours or days rather than minutes and seconds.
And speed runners compete against the times of other speed runners. Thats the whole point of it. Its the same thing. Their doing the challenge of the content and aiming to pass the speed of somebody else who already did it.
Try not making a dishonest argument lol. You’re just willfully ignoring the whole culture of speed running being competitive against one another and speed running events being competitive to try and support your bad take here.
Let this sink in. At one point, most mmo’s did not have much instanced content. WoW changed that.
Looking at your comment…
Maybe this will also change.
Having dungeons is a far cry from
Considering raids, bgs, and many dungeons were patched in months after release.
As long as we’re being dishonest, perhaps you could read the second half of my post and enlighten me as to why world first ‘races’ are not considered speed running.