Community Council won't change ANYTHING

Community General Discussion
165

That is actually a good example.

Drop rates.

Sure for a player the higher the chance, the better, right ? Not so fast.

There is a phrase that takes many forms over the different times and places it is said, but it always mean the same thing.
As I am a “Social Injustice League Fan”, I love the one used to call out Social Justice rhetoric:

  • Saying everyone is special is saying no one is.

Is it really that hard to understand that once everyone has something, the appeal to have that something vanishes ?
Is it really that hard to see that the GAME does not really benefit from everyone having everything as a sure reward ?

Contrary to what people like to say, GAME has a meaning, and in all places it means the same thing. Be it in the RPG term, or the Game of Thrones title of the show. Game is the concept of the decision making process and embodiment that pertains to demand exchange should criteria be met, leaving the players to decide WHICH game they play.

Like sacrificing what is for what can be, or sacrificing the chance to do X in doing Y, or anything in that fashion.

As soon as something start being easier, something start being a lesser “game”. That is why you also refer to hunted prey as game.

That is actually one of the worse problem in WoW, that people have been translating into the hate of borrowed powers. What borrowed powers do is to offer a Deus Ex Machina solution to make gearing up and content adequacy “fool proof”, which means not allow personal preference or misinformation lead you to do the “wrong thing”, or the “right thing” in a incorrigible way. That has the problem of also not allowing for enjoyment of discover or personal fulfillment. You will never be the credited part of making your character what it is.

It is the “sacrifice of the game itself” for the sake of “appearance”.

I can bet with you that many more players would love a game they CAN FAIL and OFTEN DO FAIL, than a game they CANNOT FAIL.

166

I refuse to accept that you responded to me with any of that. Mayhaps you intended to respond to someone with a kinder post history.

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167

…

Game is more about the questions to me.

Who, what, when, where, how, why.

And yet Blizzard fails at all of these in game most of the time.

The entire point of a video game is to go and BE Somewhere else.

WoW used to actually try at this state, now it simply meh’s and then the story is thrown at you sideways, supposedly to stick somehow while also utterly missing thanks to poorly written narrative and encounters.

…

Game is in the doing. I don’t see how WoW is much of a game these days when the metric of health is time played.

That’s like saying working yourself to death is a good thing.

168

No. Not really. Should I do what ? Tell you:

169

The Shadowlands story in particular feels very frustrating. Like they’re trying to set up a ton of cliffhangers, but it doesn’t translate well. There’s an overarching sense of forced anticipation/climax, but we don’t get to see how it evolves or finishes til the end of the xpac. That’s fair, but the story so far feels like a jumbled mess of retcons, semi-retcons, mary sue-ism, and hints at what’s happening next without ever getting the satisfaction of “aha! so that’s what happens!” Even when there is a decent revelation to be made from an ingame cutscene and such. It’s confusing.
It feels like an ever-turning wheel of “and then…and then…and then…”

WOTLK felt amazing for the story- everyone knew the Lich King from the Warcraft RTS games, and he was a big baddie built up from a decade prior, but even those who never played the old games knew who he was and what he was about well before ICC released. The storytelling through the Wrathgate and the late heroics featuring the LK were amazing, and he was peppered in through the leveling zones.

Even Deathwing in Cataclysm was the first big bad guy expansion that didn’t have much prior lore, but that storytelling went along quite well with him torching the planet off the rip and so on. It was very straightforward with some nuance if you wanted to look for it.

Contrast those two examples with what happened story and cadence-wise in WoD and Shadowlands…

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170

One could argue that those who have grievance are more likely to speak out. This thread is also a back and forth of essentially the same point between the same handful of people. I don’t see how that’s indicative of anything.

May those peoples loot drops be few and their ability procs barren.

I feel like you are missing the central point of loot drops being lower in general. People don’t want to run something weeks on end is the issue and he was suggesting a system to help with bad luck protection.

How is that a problematic to suggest?

171

Story, such that Blizzard calls it, would seem to be the elephant in the room for Shadowlands.

172

It’s an issue that only effects a microscopic portion of the community for one. And it doesn’t even top the top 10 issues discussed extensively in the community for the last year.

I have no doubt it is an important issue to the raiding community, but therein is the problem. How is the raiding community dominating the community council any different from the status quo?

EDIT: By the way it’s just after midnight on the West Coast and we are almost at 30 unique posts. Exciting!!

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173

Oh wow, didnt know they had their own forum. The introductions are very awkward. Seems too tryhard from their part. Not to mention they represent nobody but themselves and maybe their friends? I diddnt know about that forum until now!

It’s like that kid in school that got selected for X, and the rest of the kids didn’t like him for that. Same here, but these people post in a way that seems like they have a higher than thou attitude now that they have that nifty badge! Dont care if thats the case or not, perception above all.

174

I’m doing my best to be down to earth and polite but still firm, and all of the other CC members from what I’ve seen have been doing the same. Is the proper grammar bothering you? This is just how I type :stuck_out_tongue: I didn’t expect to be chosen at all for this, so I’m just doing my best.

I’m also doing my best to be the voice of not just myself and my close group of friends, but overarchingly the majority of the people I interact with, and opinions I see elsewhere. If you have any ideas or suggestions I’d love to hear them :slight_smile:

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175

Thanks, no ill will towards the members personally but it just looks bad for blizzard to do this for, lets be honest, public perception. This council is not going to do any more than what hundreds of players do in the forums every week, discuss the game.

Just seems tthat by creating this council, they are bascially brushing aside the general forums and their posters concerns and alieanating them. Basically, only the council has a voice or the spotlight, rather. Yes, thats not the case, “they cant listen or respond to all feedback” but thats how it looks

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176

Basil, what do you think the players’ odds are of getting Blizzard to admit to needing more effort into the story and making it both meaningful and both followable and relatable, as well as actually doing as such?

I keep hoping and praying they’ll figure it out, and yet, since October 2005, they just don’t seem to choose to get it.

I personally think that a story that is a metastory such that the game goes to a story driven narrative and game play with non Michael Bay game play mechanics and interactions as far as the story goes would increase subscriptions and player retention.

How do I, we, any of us, for that matter, convince them of this fact?

Because Blizzard is in love with, “rule of cool” lore, “epic do-over” story, and Michael Bay style game play, with no story substance to tie it all together into a fun, rewarding and engaging story driven game play experience.

…

I’ve been at this for 16 years. It seems like a lost cause now.

And yet it’d help their bottom line so much to have the story be the game, to let the player see and interact with the story, rather than have the story be the afterthought that’s barely ever even mentioned nowadays…

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177

I don’t think you are doing anything wrong. Blizz’s community managers have long thought their job was to cater to Youtubers, Twitch-streamers, and “content creators”

And now that all of those people have turned against Blizzard they are desperate to salvage any community interaction they can and they are failing, because some of them just don’t care and never have. coughcoughyouknowwhoyouare.

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178

Out of likes.

Spot on, Kaleaon.

Spot on.

The sad part is, they seem to confuse any effort with great effort, especially with some of the so called “content” that’s been pushed live in recent expansions.

179

Honestly, I’m really not sure. I haven’t played much of FFXIV, but what I did play, I really truly did enjoy that the game was story-centric with good pacing and compelling story and good PvE content that reinforced that. I think WoW had that for a while, but slippery sloped into something grotesque that made story and the metastory second to gameplay. But really- can you name a game that is genuinely GOOD that you fiercely enjoyed that didn’t have a good story? (Where applicable- I mean hey, even in Super Mario you had the clear goal of rescuing Peach…) The story should be the steering wheel with content being the gas pedal to back it up.

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180

I’ll be fair here. I read your postings in the council and outside it here on the forums. I think the posting with the “MT is sweet” failed due several topics revolving around “MG is harder then the original”, it felt tone-deaf and like an Ion fanboy posting.

The community doesn’t go against people if they are with you. You need to be one of them to have their back.

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181

I literally have been making threads since October 2005 to try and get Blizzard to both take WoW seriously and to try and get them to do just that and never let go, never slip from it, and to always, and I do mean always, do their best and have and keep a vision for WoW.

It’s like they confuse any effort with their best effort. And I don’t get that…

By all means, to anyone, have any of you ever seen Blizzard actually try and do their best with any content patch? Expansion, patch, or anything?

No character throughout the game is ever consistent. The story always plays second fiddle to game play. The story could instead BE the game play, the why we’re here.

And yet, all it seems is a constant push of whatever Blizzard decides is going to go live.

And damn anything else, including tacking the game nor changing the sacred vision, because apparently any and all customers are worth losing rather than changing from the sacred vision on Blizzard’s part.

Even is the sacred vision is just their making it up as they go along, any kind of user manual or game design tool kit absence be damned…

182

not sure what ur talking bout never posted about mage tower being sweet. I think recycled content is boring

183

I’m referring to this posting:

Mage tower is hard and its sweet. Probably the highlight of 9.1.5 for sure but its weird that its not available all the time.

It felt somewhat offensive while most people were discussing if it’s overtuned (and with the recent acknowledgement and more people coming forward that the developers changed it just before the release, it apparently is).

You need to be more in line what the community thinks, otherwise they will eat you alive. I think what most people want to see from the Council aren’t bootlickers but actual people who will bring the often discussed topics to the developers directly.

On the other side, what I personally missed from you Council members, is an introduction posting where write about about your preferred WoW playstyle, what you do, what you don’t and so on. It helps the rest to pick their “right people” to get engaged with.

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184

oh i did say that but yeah its still boring considering its the only thing for the whole patch