There arbitrary scoring system is arbitrary. Now who ever made said side just needs to plug which piece of gear is worth what. BIS obviously worth more then items not as high on the BIS list.
Oh and enchants. Enchants can be worth 1 - 3 points.
0 = none
1 = worthless (but hey at least they have it enchanted)
2 = Okay, but not the best.
3 = best enchant for their class.
Wasn’t even close to my point but nice attempt at trying to dissolve the point into something you can win. No, but when you are being a burden and demanding no third party performance tool is required is speaks about your character.
Do you know what happens when you get carried through content? You get to harder content that isn’t possible because there is no real way to evaluate who is being the burden. You are attempting to dismiss the entire argument on Lucifron? You can 12 man Lucifron in Classic with DM gear and a good group. At least attempt to use a better example.
You wearing gear that would allow you to progress in AQ40 but you do not do enough output for half of BWL. That happens in modern wow even on the dumbest of fights. Classic might be brain dead to a modern player with average skill but there are people who will be a burden.
No our problem is with what people could create with the information available on all of us, that we have no interest in, and don’t want to get “GearScore checked” by idiots who think that all that matters is your gear.
Raiderio doesn’t work on Classic because Classic doesn’t exist yet. I’m sure some fool can come up with a way to justify that they’re “better because their number is bigger”.
Armory for personal development can be replicated using game addons. Armory for epeening yourself against other players, not a Classic element, doesn’t need to be added and should not be added.
Armory is a Quality of Life improvement that makes things EASY for the player to do research on other players. Armory is a factual server linked function that gives REAL statistics on a character. This is indeed cutting out the NEED for you to be part of a community to know who is who.
LOL WUT? Dude, the only people who’re going to be raiding are people in a guild… There will be no pug’s raiding BWL or AQ… Molten core and Ony are nice and all, but the few pugs formed to do those aren’t going to be giving a flying leap over a rolling doughnut when it comes to how “MIN-MAX” a player is…
These people forming pugs will be happy just to have warm bodies that listen to the raid instructions… Moreover PuG’s that are raiding Ony / MC are going to typically know who’s who any way if they’re at 60 and are part of the community and thus… Armory and Raider IO are not needed at all… These things are a crutch for anti-social and lazy people.
That’s a truly ridiculous argument, not even sure why you went here at all…
Uh, dude if you’re part of the community and play the game; people are going to know you’re a slacker and terrible at your class.
Again Raider IO and Armor are not needed…
Nor are they authentic to Classic WoW and thus Armory should not be included at any point EVER.
Not because of a different opinion. Because you seem to have no understanding of the difference between what Vanilla was, and what Retail is now.
We’re trying to get away from the [Edited by Blizzard] of systems telling us how “worthy” we are, because the game was never originally about that. And you’re saying “While you’re at it, add a new feature that allows the [Edited by Blizzard] of those systems to come along for the ride”.
#NoChanges
Forum Mod Edit: This post has been edited by a moderator due to masked language as it is in violation of the Code of Conduct.
Whoa whoa whoa. Back off the personal attacks. You could have explained your point without this opening salvo.
Sure, but an experienced player such as yourself will be able to weed them out pretty quickly. I understand that modern tools make it easier on you but the whole point of Classic is playing as much as possible under authentic circumstances. And that is all my point is. It has nothing to do with me wanting handouts or wanting to be carried.
Even if you and I were to wind up on the same server (unlikely) I doubt that I would cross paths with you, trying to join a pug. I’m set in a guild, much more casual than you seem to be, and we intend to gear up together and raid on a much more relaxed schedule. I wish you all the best.
The only people raiding are going to be in a guild? Well thats just out right not true in the slightest. MC/Oxy/BWL/ZG/AQ20 have all in both actual classic and private servers have pugs for them and had pugs succeed.
What kind of delusional of memory are you having there? Just because you are happy with people wasting your time does not mean others will. What is with you people taking all this stuff to some odd extreme?
It’s a ridiculous argument because it will happen because of how modern games work, you can’t live in some fallacy assuming this will not happen even once.
If they are not needed then there is ZERO harm in having them and trust me they will be implemented by someone at some point whether you like it or not.
All of you with this severely disturbing notion that classic was some god send of era in respects to its community, it was a near perfect game for its time and will even shine in today’s sun. However, you believing some really outdated and blatantly wrong information is appalling.
In the end of the day, someone somewhere will have something similar to where you can be judged before picked up in a group. It doesn’t matter if its in game or on a site seriously… Same results will happen
Private Servers are Retail [Edited by Blizzard] applied to a Classic skin. Lets put that aside because attempting to claim that Private Servers prove something is a whole tangle of wrong.
Classic MC PuGs typically happened for 2 reasons.
A raid group was looking for recruits, so they’d put 20 people into a group, and add 20 pugs to see how good they were. Any standouts got encouraged to apply for the guild. They usually cleared up to Shazzarah where by the time had run out after PuGs who’d never been to MC couldn’t handle Geddon or Shaz.
Some douche who couldn’t find a guild, started saying “MC Run, LFM” in Org/SW General, and people would form up ask for a summons to MC then you’d lose 10 because they weren’t attuned, you’d get 10 more and go in. It would be a complete [Edited by Blizzard], and they’d maybe kill Magmadar.
The only other one would be PuGs from raiding guilds who’d finished MC on rotation, and weren’t running it organised, but the Rogue still wanted Thunderfury, so he’d convince a group to get together and do it, with a decent core and a pile of PuG warm bodies. And then they’d disband after Geddon.
Forum Mod Edit: This post has been edited by a moderator due to masked language as it is in violation of the Code of Conduct.
Grats on playing on an EZ mode server with made up calculations…
LOL no dude, I play with my guild so that I am not surrounded by idiots who use Raider IO.
Actually it’s not a ridiculous argument because ARMORY was a TBC feature, not a “VANILLA” feature, and I could give a damn what modern gamers want, this is not a modern game.
3rd party, who cares those inaccurate trash sites never last and the quality is usually crap. So who cares, they had some junky sites back in the day and there are some now, they’re still garbage compared to TBC / Wrath armory.
Vanilla had its faults, but I know for a fact after playing TBC and Wrath and watching all the QoL garbage added and the EASE of access; these things undermined the game and the community.
I did not suffer in PVE because of these because I was in a strong guild, but I watched the community deteriorate around me… This is one of the things that really turned me off about Wrath, well that and the Wrath expansion was overall garbage when compared to TBC or Vanilla.
You’re in no better place in your absurd argument than the guy that’s promoting LFR or Flying…
This is the exact reason why the guys who spam “No changes” do so… Because it’s ridiculous to even consider functions like this from OUTSIDE the Vanilla experience.
Gatekeep? The entire Classic community is trying to hold fast to the notion that Classic should be as Vanilla-like as possible. It’s not gatekeeping, it’s a whole hearted attempt to recreate something that GearScore and all of its spiritual descendents killed. If you want Retail, play Retail.
That isn’t the point the point is the pure resistance to something that would have zero affect on mechanical game play. It is a third party application so someone does not have to run to IF or SW to inspect someone or take something at face value.
The entire point was not to create some division in anything except those wishing to extort others which is the point of these applications. You forget that the community on a server won’t allow this division which is a self policing force within itself.
Since you were willing to apologize, I will as well. The point is yes, while the game is trivial there always will be abuse, there always will be that person. It will prevent those who don’t socialize well and bridge a gap when used correctly with a server population. That was the point.
If you are subpar wearing high end raid gear, the average vanilla player won’t openly bring it up. They will whisper you and offer to help, they will teach you as we all experienced. If anything a third party server tool will help place people ino proper guilds and grow it just as niche servers on retail do like Turaylon (Lovely server).
As a sign of mutual agreement to understanding each other, if you would like my 58 page fully comprehension Warlock guide for Vanilla warlock I will send it to you. I am withholding it until classic launch because frankly I was going to donate it to a Specific Youtuber who I luckily found out was going to straight up steal it from me and claim ownership of it even though it will be a free public tool.
Rather you like it or not this is the gaming culture that we are in now a days. You bring a old game back and that culture doesn’t just magically go away. Its going to happen one way or another
Also your server in classic must of been a real poor community as multiple guilds on Spirestone-US would host learning groups and pugs for all raids up to AQ20 with only 5-10 actual guild members in it. You really need to check yourself.
Literally no one in this thread is asking for mechanical or gameplay changes. A third party application is not going to murder your entire dream, we had forums back then you know and other tools. Not really any different.