we were talking about mythic lockout 
i was talking to the other guy about conquest.
WoW isnât the only MMO out there and other games manage things just fine without creating restrictions on everything.
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The important thing that good developers remember is the simple idea of âmoderation in all thingsâ
Except Blizzard has been anything but moderate on time gating and rng.
Neither one are inherently bad, they do serve a purpose. But anything, when used in excess, can become a problem.
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While I agree with you, thereâs one small, teeny tiny problem with what you saidâŚ
They said âfunâ, youâre saying âefficientâ.
Something being efficient doesnât make it any more fun - just makes it easier, faster. And while Retailâs rep grind is inarguably both of these things, the way it still manages to feel slow by stopping you every day is the crux of the issue.
Itâs a grind that should be simple, quick and fun thatâs artificially stretched out to no benefit of the player.
This is something very important to consider, too. WoW doesnât exist in a vacuum, it has competition, and some of that competition is doing certain things better than WoW. While I still like this game better as an overall package, itâs absolutely fair to draw comparisons.
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Old school pencil and paper RPGs have even straight up said this.
âWhen the rules get in the way of fun, bend the rules.â
The rules in this case is poorly handled amounts of timegating.
Itâs a game, the end result should be fun, not feeling like youâre wasting your time.
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Iâm sorry I didnât give you the attention you so obviously crave, dude.
Youâre absolutely right, the thrilling murloc trading game and the occasional rare drop make it 100% better.
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Thanks, Dad.
Wait, Iâm Dad. Which is why I only have 1 day in a week to play sometimes. Grinding rep on that day is super unhealthy though. Please, Blizzard, save me from myself.
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So itâs not 20 days like you claim. Just like classic if youâre willing to put it effort its less.
downplaying it doesnât make it any less true.
Bingo
/10char
The murloc trading game also relies on one of the murlocs spawning in his cave. IE its RNG. The items that drop to give extra rep are also RNG.
So, its 20 days RELIABLY. Maybe less if RNG is nice to you. Still not a good system.
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Thereâs been countless MMOs that did things VERY differently than WoW, many are dead and shutdown. Even games like ESO will decline once Elder Scrolls 6 comes out.
FFXIV will only survive fairly long due to a 20+ year old fanbase.
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Um itâs also a really good game thatâs improved more and more with each expansion. The chick that wrote shadowbringers would absolutely school Blizzardâs writing team. Her stories are top notch.
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I donât know about you, but twenty days of fairly trivial tasks for a single item doesnât sound so hot.
Even ten would prompt screaming in any other genre.
Iâve never been quite sure why MMO players are so keen to perform meaningless tasks for days on end. I say âmeaninglessâ in the sense that the only reason you have to do them is that Blizzard put a carrot at the end. I know everything in the game is inherently meaningless.
But when youâre not having fun, not being challenged, not experiencing anything novel, what reason do these tasks have to exist save to eat your time?
Obviously this sort of thing isnât unique to the current game, but even when I started, I never saw the point of content that simply exists to make you log in, and not to enjoy yourself, challenge yourself, or see something new and exciting.
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lol, yeah itâs not looking good for retail. But itâs kinda a tricky position for WoW. The story for WoW went downhill when Cataclysm was released, after all the Warcraft RTS story was exhausted and it just didnât work.
There really needs to be a Warcraft IV RTS again, then have WoW II pick it up after a few WC4 expansions. It would be the best for the long run, but would definitely hurt Blizzard financially in the short-term.
FFXIVâs subscriber base has been steadily increasing over itâs lifetime. Just before Shadowbringers released Square Enix said more people were currently subscribed than ever before, and the new expansion has been widely hailed as the best expansion to date.
So six years after A Realm Reborn released their subscriber base continues to grow.
Well hey, maybe A Realm Reborn will be the WOTLK for Final Fantasy. MMOs are too static to flourish for a long time I think, playing in the same world that barely changes geopolitically can get pretty stale.
MMOs I donât think handle being able to travel to different timelines very well.
Exactly. I canât imagine not having a standing desk or doing something every hour to get up and stretch a bit.
I was just adding details to the guy who tried to say âwell thereâs the murloc trading and drops that give you extra bodyguard xp!â
Those are both RNG related. Ergo, not reliable.
I wasnât agreeing that the amount of time was kosher. 20 days worth of grinding, especially when its not a huge amount of power, just aint worth it.
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still requires effort to get them. Just pointing out what he was saying isnât true. Even if RNG based itâll be faster than the 20 day like he claims.
But hey keep waving your arms around saying rng! rng! rather than doing the work.
Laughs in Hydraxian Waterlords