your argument wasnt a tangent at all lmao, just too “nuanced” for them XD
I mean, that’s simple. What EA did, with actual loot crates gave actual pay2win advantages because there was no way for regular players to get the same items to be able to compete. Unlike Blizzard who while people can buy stuff, none of the stuff they can buy are going to be at a level where regular players can’t also get. EA’s whole system was designed to make paying the only option. We can see in retail WoW that the majority of the userbase don’t even use the token and play the game just fine. These are two separate scenarios that you are trying to equate even though the actual details are completely difference. Hence the tangent by trying to get us focused on what EA did and pretending that somehow compares.
it literally mentioned free to play being at a disadvantage by not having access to things that people have to pay to get. if wow classic tbc was free and you could only get 500 exp a day without paying extra for it that would be p2w.
Just make fresh servers with no boost available and everyone will be happy! omfg it’s not that hard.
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Seriously, at some point it is just like, “Read our posts again. We’ve been through this. Many times.”
i’m debating if i should just type in all caps with bold for him to understand.
I mean, that’s simple. What EA did, with actual loot crates gave actual pay2win advantages because there was no way for regular players to get the same items to be able to compete.
Not true, the characters were unlockable through gameplay, it just took significant amount of time to earnt he currency for them.
Unlike Blizzard who while people can buy stuff, none of the stuff they can buy are going to be at a level where regular players can’t also get.
As stated before, world first guilds already spend thousands of dollars on tokens to afford the best gear possible.
We can see in retail WoW that the majority of the userbase don’t even use the token and play the game just fine.
Do you have any kind of proof for this? Because I recall WoD making tokens so cheap that people were storing years worth of gameplay time.
tokens were only cheap because garrisons vomited free gold and you could only buy game time. do you remember how much they cost in legion when you could buy overwatch and stuff with them? they were over 260k at that time.
Fresh start at 58 servers for the booster babies or fresh start at 1 servers that dont have boosts for the rest of us. i agree.
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Literally nowhere does it state it has to be people who play for free. It states “non-paying players,” as in people who don’t pay for the microtransaction.
Hence why I was utterly baffled by the claim that I was going off on an unrelated tangent by pointing out pay-to-play games that offer P2W advantages.
for like the third time, it does not say that. It says an advantage over other players who do not pay. “AN ADVANTAGE” that doesn’t mean people who don’t play don’t have access to those things at all, it means that they would be better off paying than if they didn’t.
It is kinda like if my dad gave me a small loan of a million dollars. I would have an advantage over most people in America even though they technically could get a job and earn a million dollars.
And you don’t think paying $20 to get a quarter-million gold isn’t a significant advantage? Seriously?
Players who care about level 1-60 are already playing classic and almost certainly already have at least 1 level 60. Players who will boost are going to be players who don’t care about the vanilla leveling experience by and large, either because they explicitly waited for TBC to start or because they want to go with a new class for TBC and don’t care to level through 1-60 again.
Nothing about a level 58 with bad gear in TBC is winning, not sure why you think it is. You’re not getting a level 70 decked out in sunwell gear. Level 58 and the quality of gear you’ll have will be easily attainable without buying a boost.
In some games, players who are willing to pay for special items, downloadable content, or to skip cooldown timers may be able to gain an advantage over those playing for free who might otherwise hardly be able to access said items. Such games are called “pay-to-win” by critics. In general a game is considered pay-to-win when a player can gain any gameplay advantage over their non-paying peers. Market research indicates that pay-to-win mechanics are considered much more acceptable by players in Ch…
i can’t post links but this is part of what one of the things you linked, says.
Shadowlands is itself a P2W game. P2P and P2W are not mutually exclusive. Shadowlands is both. A paid time saving boost in Classic TBC would be P2W. If everyone was allowed one FREE boost, it would still be a mistake in my eyes, but it would not be P2W. It’s really simple.
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Yes? What point are you trying to make? It’s exactly what I quoted.
That is a big assumption. Even if true, paying for a boost is a pill that not everyone is willing to swallow.
No one is saying the boost is such a ridiculous advantage. But for the sake of argument, it IS an advantage over those who do not use the boost.
While I don’t fundamentally agree with boosts at all, at the very least putting everyone on the same page regardless is absolutely not P2W and wouldn’t bother me nearly as much.
it specifically says advantage over those playing for free. and that it’s paid to win when you can gain an advantage over their non-paying peers. did you read what you linked at all? dear jeebus.
Nowhere does it say free. It says non-paying. As in people who didn’t pay for whatever was purchased. If it was stating free-to-play players, it would specifically say free-to-play.