Agreed. Which makes the call for the BFA loot firehose equally lacking in substance.
I disagree that anyone who pays for a sub should get Heroic CN gear even if they don’t log in at all.
its more casual than it has ever been, you are just terrible at the game bub hahahahahahah
Oh that is a heck of a stretch. Who said they should get by not logging in at all. Now you are trying to build a strawman
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Your only stated qualification for getting gear below mythic raid threshold is that they should be paying the same sub cost. How many hours of gameplay per week would you gate Heroic CN gear behind?
How many is the threshold to deserve to progress your character in your eyes? How much time should someone have available to be deserving of their skinner box serotonin reward?
I’m fine with the system as it stands now. You’re the one wanting the system to change. So tell us how many hours of gameplay per week should entitle someone to CN Heroic gear.
Yes, there should be. But im seeing a lot more premade coming in and just farming against an opposing team. where they are 100 ilvls higher ( in total ) then the team they are fighting.
I Guess the only way to know would be screenshot (players list), 10 battles.
Then weigh them out. See who was wearing what and how much of it was balanced based on ilvl and who won. Would make for a great post ill bet 
But premades are coming in for your faction as well, right? Unless you’re talking full 15 man premades.
And there are more and more threads about the issues with gearing. People hate the 1 loot for m+, etc. You want to talk about time invested? Ok so you spend roughly 30 min on a m+, only to get one piece of gear that one of 5 people get. Yeah not rewarding at all.
Jared, it’s quite clear that you are happy to call everyone who supports the system names. And that you think that people should at least log on to be entitled to gear like every other sub payer. And that that gear should not include CN Mythic gear.
Do you want to walk that back? Because I’m happy to hear how many hours of playtime should entitle a sub payer to CN Heroic gear. What about CN Normal?
The OP has only responded once to this thread, so I think he vented and ran. But ultimately, one has to have reasonable expectations for the game depending on how much time they have to invest each day. One hour a day commitment is going to be slow going. If one considers this game a race to compete with other players and only has one hour a day, of course it’s going to feel disappointing. Take away the desire to “keep up” with people, then it eases the stress.
What is the minimum someone should play and do to get an increase in power? You just said you are fine with what it is now, but even now its a huge RNG possibility. You can go hours in dungeons or raid and not get anything. So what is the level of time sink is acceptable for that skinner box?
I’m casual. 42, family and job. I play maybe 2 hours a day at night once my kids go to sleep. Sometimes less, sometimes more. Sometimes I miss a day or two. I think I’m doing alright for my main. I realize I’ll never get mythic gear or raiding gear (those days are long gone), but as long as my gear is at a respectable level to play the content then I’m good.
However, running alts through SL just feels like a huge chore. Every time I try, I wind up in Legion trying to get artifact weapons or transmogs. That should tell you something.
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I’m not saying time spent should equate to gear at all. Why do you think someone who RPs all day without doing any other content should be entitled to raid gear just because they’ve spent time in the game?
It’s quite amusing to see that I’m providing you answer after answer while you squirm away from the obvious flaw in your argument. You say time spent playing should entitle you to CN Heroic gear and my simple query is how many hours for CN Heroic and how many hours for CN Normal.
I get what your saying about evening out.
Im speaking on a player scale and balancing that scale individually so rather then winning a bg based on GEAR ( did you get random placed with the BEST geared team) being the deciding factor both teams go in evenly geared ( Not up to chance) and the BG is won based on skill/strategy. rather then their team averaged 5 ilvls per player more then ours and therefore has better advantage in over all …etc…etc…
Templates and scaling were loudly criticised when they were in place for Legion. And random BGs have never been won or lost on the basis of skill alone. Ever.
How is this different than any other expansion ?
I’d say Shadowlands is more friendly than ever on this front : there’s literal gear catch-up in the x.0 patch! As of this week, you have a 9 piece set of 190 gear available from just questing normally.
Yah, im seeing that loud cry as that group who can’t pew pew huge numbers and bottle that swag for twitch and youtube.
I think i would rather agree to disagree.
Given that random BGs and PVP in general suffered huge hits in Legion and were either a joke (with corruption) or were dead in BFA (BGs) do you have any data to suggest that the people who enjoy the traditional mode of WoW PVP where gear makes a difference are outnumbered by / outnumber the number of people who want a system where gear makes no difference?
How? (Not arguing just trying to help gear a friend)