I just looked up my Dungeon Tools add on to see what all the abilities were, and it was a rain of Bleeding Jabs (probly the tank not facing all the enemies properly away from group) venomous spit (which I can only kick 1 target myself), and Web Bolts coming in from everywhere.
A lot of tanks make a very, very big mistake thinking they can go from mass pulling AK in heroic to mass pulling AK+5, and then are surprised when the entire group gets gunned down by casters.
3 Likes
Thats odd. I got invited to a 4 last night while being 593 and not having run each of the dungeons yet.
3k io player bud. Im not the one struggling in 4s while geared for 7s lol
Kick
Blind
Gouge
Kidney Shot
Vanish + Garrote
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Do you ever get tired of overcomplicating things?
The old system had more increments, and earlier, easier increments. That’s what OP wants. I don’t agree with OP, especially since Delves exist.
It’s not much deeper than that.
2 Likes
yes. i voted for you. i hope you don’t mind.
You can’t die.
But also you need to do A LOT DAMAGE.
And you need to kill things really fast.
And most dungeons you need at least 2 different types of dispels (decurse, poison cleanse) in addition to the standard magic dispel.
You’ve barely timed two +4s, and have done horrible in the few +2s you’ve completed.
Stop talking.
I want to hear from people who are actually good at the game, which isn’t you.
Reverting back does nothing. Instead of being capped at +5s you’ll just be capped at +15s.
The problem is a Tier 8 delve is even easier than a M0.
M0, or if they purely just want to learn the dungeon mechanics, Heroics are now the current season dungeons and I feel like they work as a good learning tool, too.
Nah
I haven’t completely settled on an opinion about Delves, but they do feel easy for the gear they give. Slightly, if nothing else.
Fundamentally and structurally, though, I like how things piece together right now.
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Then those players shouldn’t be doing content they’re not geared for.
It’s really a simple concept. If you want to do harder content, first you get the gear so you’re ready for that content, then you do the content to gear yourself up for the next step up the difficulty ladder. Is it possible to jump a few rungs if you’re really good or you’re with a good team? Yes. Is that the ideal route for everyone to take? Not at all.
This used to be a simple concept that everyone understood, but for some reason in this expansion specifically I’ve seen people constantly trying to make massive leaps up the difficulty ladder that they’re clearly not ready for, then complaining that they get wrecked by the content they’re not ready for. People trying to do T8 Delves as soon as the season started for example, just rushing through the content expecting easy mode and then getting shocked when they get wrecked.
What people getting into M+ should be doing to ‘learn the mechanics’ is do M0, because you have all the time in the world there to learn the mechanics and optimal route for each dungeon and you will never be at risk of bricking a key because you died or you took too long to kill a pack.
Right now heroic difficulty is as difficult as a M0 was at the start of Dragonflight.
M0 is as difficult as a 10+ key.
M10+ is as difficult as a M20+ key.
If you can’t do M+ keystones, you’re not ready. Either find a better team (if it’s the team letting you down and not your own poor performance) or go back to easier content until your ilvl is high enough that you can do the M+ key you were on more easily.
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That honestly sounds more like people not interrupting, a tank not holding aggro, or people not using defensives. All necessary now. Earlier, yes, you’re right, you could do 2-9 with very little mob knowledge or even class kit knowledge. Mobs would roll over of at least one geared DPS was there to mow them down. And bonus points if the tank was also geared.
Now, not so much, basically everyone has to pull their weight early on.
Heroic gear, once upgraded, is enough for low keys. Add bountiful delves to that and the gap closes pretty fast.
I wish I had the time for more keys 
I do think there is an issue though: delve gear being so high has made people think they can just skip the first 4 levels of m+. Unfortunately mechanics are deadly and if you didn’t actually try zeroes and 2s first, many get annihilated.
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why do they have to breeze through it?
when did everyone decide that progression should never involve failure?
6 Likes
Since delve loot 
lol
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I did +2, and got one shot because I failed to see a portal from my behind. Now I have PTSD and won’t go into mythic
Agreed with the Nah.
I know what Blizzard said leading into DF S4.
It was either exceedingly poorly worded and never properly clarified (ie: they meant a S4 M0 would be roughly equal to a S3 M+10 with the affixes taken out) or just bullcrap to begin with (possibly just a result of poor Blizzard tuning).
M0s are harder than they used to be.
But they’ve never felt like what used to be a +10, with or without affixes. Not once.
…10s were not as hard as you’re remembering them, I think.
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Delves. Blizzard REALLY wants you to play ALL of the content that they create, that they can get you to do (that doesn’t make you unsub).