I do actually agree, for the most part, that I’m not interested in seeing more characters on the LGBT spectrum if their sole purpose is just to be a token to be included.
It should be a core part of their character; it should define their relationships, and it should be a source of growth and conflict for them personally, just like it is in real life.
Token characters serve no purpose and satisfy no one- well written characters, however… That just so happen to be LGBT, now that I can get behind.
(I also absolutely ship Wrathion x Anduin and no one can tell me I’m wrong, and it has everything to do with that cinematic.)
This is my stance, and something I say all the time. Sexuality is not all someone is. It is a part of them. People make it into all that matters though, and that cheapens characters.
We should be asking for well written characters. If they happen to be gay or whatever, that’s cool too, but it should be a part of them. Not the reason they are included.
Shaw and Flynn are a bad example of this. Shaw has never once shown some kind of romantic interest in either direction, and then in one book over the course of two chapters, he’s suddenly beyond intoxicated with Flynn. This makes it feel rushed, forced, and like bad juju. There was no buildup. It was quite literally that Shaw got flung into a wall, Flynn landed on top of him, Shaw got a whiff of Flynn’s beer soaked coat, and was suddenly dreaming about him and thinking about him. That’s dumb.
If Shaw and Flynn had more build up, and felt more natural, it would have been loads better because people could appreciate the organic interactions between them. Instead, we got something that feels forced, and like it’s pushing an agenda because it happens to be 2020.
I’ve also been vocally in the camp that romance does not belong in WoW. We are murder hobos. We kill things for 20 gold and purples. You could be a blue person who’s lesbian interested in the green woman who happens to be pansexual. Does that mean anything to me? No. Your 20 gold and your quest reward / upgrade are what mean something to me.
I agree, and I think that the writers should do whatever they feel is best for the story.
The problem too when it comes to diversity and inclusion in games or movies, is who gets to decide what needs to be included? It becomes a slippery slope and never ends if everyone has to be included. There’s always going to be someone left out, and if the writers burn all their energy trying to please everyone then the output will suffer so.
I agree, the thread should die. But considering the other responses, and the fact it’s not going to, I had to toss in my agreement with the other post.
You’re missing the point. I believe that it’s natural, and it can change in time. I don’t at all believe that it’s a choice, but I believe that it’s still something that people can identify with and figure out for themselves. You’re being purposely obtuse for the sake of arguing.
Let’s look at my best friend as an example. She’s always considered herself bisexual, but after a 5 year relationship with a man came to an end earlier this year, she is now beginning to think she leans more towards lesbian.
Her sexuality is changing with her identity, her experiences, and who she is. It cannot be “taken” from her or converted out of her as you so rudely implied. It also is not a “choice” she is actively making; it is instead a realization she is accepting.
That’s gay culture baby. Immediately falling in love and planning a whole future with the nice guy you just met? I don’t know a gay who hasn’t done that.
For real tho… In game meeting with great banter, and probably more interactions not shown considering they were working together on a serious mission, Shaw hinting he wanted to get to know him better, Shaw pointing out that all he had in his life was war and clearly wanting more, two books worth of build up for them to end at…going on a first date. How much build do y’all want?
Like there is no amount of build up that will ever be “Enough” for LGBTQ people …For some reason.
Sorry fam but too many self identifying people have caused issues for the marginalized community, especially POC. We’ve already seen people posing as someone marginalized who then takes away from those are actually marginalized. This is why I called out that person’s friends for simply saying, “Hey we just identify as this”. It’ s an issue because by their words the imply sexuality is a choice, yeah in most cases it’s not. Thought we moved past the “It’s a choice” phase? It’s 2020 and wording matters.
Though I’d also have an issue with the OP only listing same sex couples, the LGBT community is bigger than just girl/girl boy/boy stuff.
Your wording implies choice. You imply that sexuality is fluid so therefore someone gay could become straight, the means doesn’t matter. It’s a two way street. If that’s what you weren’t implying then be better and choose your words better.
I think that you wanted my wording to imply choice, even though I’d like to see you quote me using that word. All I said was that sexuality is a fluid experience that can change with time, and you’re the one who began mentioning weird things about conversion therapy. You’re the one reaching for straws here, man. It’s really saddening to see someone so actively against the LGBTQ community who knows so little about how sexual orientation is identified and embraced.
I’m not the one who made the post, you did. So don’t put your failure with what you meant on me. I’m the one that’s saying people are born gay, sure as heck didn’t imply it was a choice nor was I against anything. So you can go away now.
I hope that he writes the couples better than Thrall/Aggra were written, as well as most of Malfurion/Tyrande storyline. The reason I don’t want any couples at all is because of those examples.
Strong characters that aren’t traditional? Yes.
Cheesy, pandering, in your face “love” story arcs that takes 2 powerful characters and cripples them with codependency for the whole expansion? No thanks.
Your implication of my post is on you. No one else read it that way, only you did.
I agreed with you that people are born into a sexuality and it changes with time. I also stated that self-identifying as an LGBTQ person is extremely important because it allows that person to find acceptance within themselves and begin to become the person they wish to be. Self identifying is the difference between an assigned gender and a chosen gender. It helps people come out. You can be born gay and still have the desire to identify as gay. They are two completely separate things, individual and unique to each person.
I was expanding on a point you made in a civil way when you decided to perceive it as an attack on your views and character. You’re the one spewing words about “choice” and “conversion therapy” and you still didn’t quote me where I said it was a choice. I never said it was a choice, but for some reason, you decided to read it that way and roll with it.
There’s also extensive research that shows that sexual orientation can change with age. It can transform, broaden, narrow in, and alter. None of this has to do with actual choice. Sexual orientation is not carved in stone like you are trying to make it appear. It’s called fluidity, and before you mention conversion therapy again, I recommend educating yourself on it.
I’m all for it, but if it’s going to be done… it’s gotta feel organic and not a forced feeling between two already set/known characters. If it’s going to be done and done right… I feel you gotta make it a mild back story with a current and new character, or bring in a gay couple(s) with shadowlands. Sexuality is still a big point of discussion here in the states… so I’m not sure how it’d play out here.
Yea you’re probably right, it probably wouldn’t play out well at all. Lots of hate too… i’ll never personally understand why they hate the gay community so much.
