I feel like you don’t play M+ at all, despite having good score.
You barely even have to heal in 20+ dungeons because the group doesn’t get hit by avoidable damage which 1-2 shots.
There’s nothing to heal for the majority of the dungeon.
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Healers do deserve and should have access to good damage, though. If not simply for the ability to level comfortably and not be an absolute slog to level as.
As long as this condition exists and scales appropriately, so too will the meta of healers being expected to contribute to the scenario damage requirements whether it be arena, RBG, M+, or Raiding. The only way this expectation will be removed is if a healer’s damaging abilties are…disabled inside of instances, which I think would just upset more people than it would please them.
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It varies wildly from trash pack to pack and boss to boss.
Some trash I go in with planned cooldowns knowing I’ll be pumping heals and others I’m basically just spamming SCK and maintaining a hot.
Same with some bosses.
I’d argue the variance is nice, and it would be worse if each pack/boss had the same damage patterns.
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I healed before lizard enlightenment. So, when did you do your 20s?
Don’t heal if you don’t want to heal
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The funny thing here is this is Tank mentality in FF14. If the DPS run ahead and pulls, the tank considers them free mit.
Tank = Does damage to achieve their goal of holding aggro.
Healer = Healing to achieve their goal of well… healing.
Do you see the difference?
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that depends a lot on the group. I hardly have anything to heal even in 23-26 runs because burst/cc matters. here I usually know who will take damage and wants to get maximum dmg out. I don’t even want to know what it looks like in higher keys at the moment. because for me 2 keys a day are already too much.
and 20s are causal content. if someone claims that a 2800 rating means something, they live in the other universe on the planet with pink ponies…
i am not trolling. I dont troll. It was merely sarcasm jeez
that is no longer needed. that was the case many years ago. now they even have gear with double stats and respec without gold.
and a healer who can also do dmg, successfully tanked the dungeon is worth a lot of gold.
Depends what you want. Currently most healers can sit around 40-50k without at highest level. I’ve had disc priest beat me on boss fights as a tank. Most healers I’ve had pugging sit around 40k with an aug. Still a lot of healing to do this season so can’t expect amazing dps.
? If a tank hits for 10,000 with a threat multiplier of 1x and can hold aggro they can do the same thing if we make them hit for 100 with a multipler of 100x. Again, why are tanks allowed to do damage yet healers can’t?
Some before, some after.
My problem with this oft-repeated argument is that aggro has nothing to do with why tanks deal damage. This is because the amount of damage that the tank needs to do to maintain aggro is actually incredibly small. Barring some extremely unusual circumstances, a non-tank pulling aggro isn’t really something that happens in normal gameplay and hasn’t been since the removal of Skittish.
Instead what we see is tanks dealing damage far above what’s required for them to hold aggro. Why do they do so much more damage than they need to when it’s not their job? Two reasons:
- Damage is damage no matter who it comes from.
- Their defensives are oGCD while their damage is GCD. Doing damage does not impede their ability to use defensives. Quite the opposite, most tanks need to do damage in order to generate the resources needed to use their active mitigation.
Good tanks still aim to maximize their damage output while still performing the necessary job of tanking. Note that doesn’t mean they’re trying to compete with the DPS… because it’s not a competition. The only damage number that matters is the sum total damage done by the entire group and the tank makes that number go up just as surely as the DPS does.
Now there are two crucial differences between tanks and healers that you haven’t pointed out. The first is that unlike a tank’s defensives, most healing spells are GCD and therefore directly compete with damage for use of a characters GCDs. The second is that tanking is different from damage/healing in that for damage/healing, it does not matter who the damage/healing comes from. Only that the party as a whole meets the damage/healing requirements set by the dungeon. However only one person can be tanking at a time since enemies will only ever have one target at a time. This is why hybrid off-healing is so common but you’ve never seen hybrid off-tanking.
Don’t get so hung up on what each role is “supposed” to do. The only thing that matters is what each character is capable of doing. A bulk of a party’s healing requirement will come from the healer as they are the most able character at healing. However healing is not always required and it is not the only way a healer can contribute. Good healers (or players in general) seek to contribute in any way they can to maximize the chance of success for the run. That means when you don’t need to contribute healing or some other utility, you should contribute damage. This logic is the same reason why tanks maximize their damage. They don’t really care about aggro since that isn’t really a concern.
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Just play a different game.
Sympathetic to healers getting closer to equal with damage.
Personally I think healers should have at least 2x the damage of a tank. Also remove all self healing (and make potions unusable) for all dps classes.
Tanks should be far less self-reliant…
But again, it’s just better to play a different game now. This one is too stuck in the dying ways of the 2010s.
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Tank damage is probably on the higher end because the devs wanted to entice players to the role, same with the self reliance. The tank is already responsible for routing, positioning, and pull cadence. The majority of interruptible or disruptible mechanics fall on tanks too it seems. At least in a pug environment. That’s a lot to put on one role when the rest have significantly less decision making to do on the fly.
To compensate, dps are given procs to spice up the rotation and mechanics are the most punishing to these roles if they fail them. Softer and shorter defensives, weaker self healing. Generally the talent trees don’t have baked in damage reduction like tanks and heals.
Heals is the weird outlier here. You have dungeons that are almost entirely mechanic based damage that a tank plus 4 dps can execute flawlessly with minimal rot damage that off healing can cover. There is no routing or positioning load to cover. The gameplay decision making is what spell matches the current incoming damage profile. In raid and m+ both, once you learn the dances, this is very telegraphed and can be memorized. With good teams, I know EXACTLY what pulls I’m going to cast revival on, or when I’m casting sheilun’s gift at a higher stack count so I’m going to sand bag the cast for a few more globals.
We either increase rot and spike damage to force healers to heal more often and remove the damage requirement from them to time keys (environment now) or we ramp up the damage requirement of keys and bake it into healers.
Net time in the dungeon is a trackable metric, the timer and rating formulas are proof. So they have a set goal (obviously) and that goal remains unchanged for healer damage because the goal is still you spend x minutes in this content for a chance at y reward. It just FEELS better and like you’re contributing more.
If healer participation is flagging, damage is an obvious lever they can tune. I just wouldn’t expect it mid season or patch. Next xpac though, I wouldn’t be surprised to see heals doing 2x what they’re at today.
At like 420’ilvl my monk is only pushing like 25-35k dps if I can go ham on a pull. Dicey pulls where I’m having to throw out more direct heals/hots it’s much lower. Seeing that at 50k would be largely irrelevant to my experience, especially if 20k dps * seconds in the key was added to mob health pools…
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If you only heal as a healer your a garbage healer you also need to dispell, use CC, mitigate damage via absorb shields or damage reductions, interupt if you have one and deal damage cause the Healers job is not to heal but to KEEP THE GROUP ALIVE
Also important to mention depending on which healer you play you may get extra utility to help keep your group alive such as rescue on Preservation and tiger’s lust on Mistweaver.
I really enjoyed discipline’s weird little take on doing damage as a healer when i first tried it. But when i wanted to go back to being a normal healer suddenly that option wasn’t really what was wanted any more. I do not like healer DPS being mandatory and if it is possible to do more than a certain amount, players will demand it. I would prefer a less spiky damage profile, with more constant, difficult to avoid damage so instead of sitting and waiting for someone to go THWACK and lose 80% health and i have 1 second to fix that, i am instead managing multiple constantly falling bars. Of course giant thwacks that have prewarning are fine. Gotta have your thwacks somewhere.