Bring back Masterlooter

[Chaosknite-frostmourne]

Thank god your rant is over. Dont need luck from a rando from the WoW forums to live my life.

[Estalayia-borean-tundra]

@Maidenofbeer-proudmoore

blizzard says no

Until they say “yes”. Remember “no” to Classic? Remember how multi-boxing used to work via the replicating software? Remember how long both of those used to be, until Blizzard changed their mind? “No” is not indefinite.

I wouldn’t put all of my eggs in the basket that reads “Blizz said ‘no’” 'cause that “no” can always turn into a “yes”.

[Bloodypaws-frostmourne]

@Cäpslöck-proudmoore

How many complaints could have just been better served by the person (or in your case bot) doing the complaining just leaving the group in question?

So we reward the group or persons who hold the loot ransom?

[Maidenofbeer-proudmoore]

@Estalayia-borean-tundra

@Maidenofbeer-proudmoore

blizzard says no

Until they say “yes”. Remember “no” to Classic? Remember how multi-boxing used to work via the replicating software? Remember how long both of those used to be, until Blizzard changed their mind? “No” is not indefinite.

I wouldn’t put all of my eggs in the basket that reads “Blizz said ‘no’” 'cause that “no” can always turn into a “yes”.

Blizzard has said no and stayed with no to a lot more things than they have changed their minds. When they do change… they are usually making money off of it.

people in this thread are still married to variations of ML/PL. There could be a lot of different/better ways of doing it.maybe come up with something new? or just go back and forth with the same BS arguments for another 2k posts.

[Estalayia-borean-tundra]

@Maidenofbeer-proudmoore

Blizzard has said no and stayed with no to a lot more things than they have changed their minds

Such as…?

@Maidenofbeer-proudmoore

maybe come up with something new?

I have and only responding in accordance to the same 'ol arguments (which is something you brought up, BTW).

@Maidenofbeer-proudmoore

or just go back and forth with the same BS arguments for another 2k posts

It’s not"BS", now you’re derailing into ad hominems, and I’m disappointed 'cause you were one of the few left, on the anti-ML side that didn’t resort to that but now you are.

And, as long as others stop using the same 'ol arguments, you won’t get the same 'ol response. IK it can be exhausting to read a plethora of posts, so I give the benefit of the doubt. As to that’s why they keep getting brought up 'cause reading over 2k of posts can be exhausting, when you want to jump right into the conversation. You might miss what’s already been said and may end up repeating the conversation.

[Maidenofbeer-proudmoore]

when I said BS, I meant both sides. no one is changing minds we have the same people playing tennis with their arguments. neither side is covered with glory. We have some people willing to discuss ideas, but most are stuck with the “no Im not, what are you” debate style. The ML with changes or the PL with changes could be agreed on by the more open minded of us. I support the ml form you proposed earlier. But posts like that are covered by the pvp epeen battle or the “you wanna steal my stuff/ let me play the way I wanna” fights. Thos are the BS arguments I can do without. I dont really care who has what achieves if they can come up with ideas and listen to others with an open mind.

[Estalayia-borean-tundra]

That’s fair and I agree. I apologize for the misunderstanding.

[Avelpally-frostmourne]

@Bynxy-stormrage

No, we are asking for it to come back with a requirement that ensures all active parties agree to using it.

It wouldn’t even affect pugs. Because if you agree to it then still do it, it’s your fault

They don’t care. They have decided what they think we want and whatever we say that disagrees with their pre conceived idea they ignore. It’s impossible to have a conversation with people who are not conversing in good faith.

I said let’s do it in ce only guilds so it wouldn’t impact any of the people that are against it in the thread and rather than talking about the possible merits or not of it they decided to point out that my 2 night guild isn’t top world 500. Like I wasn’t aware of that fact or like it has any relevance to the conversation.

@Maidenofbeer-proudmoore

I meant both sides. no one is changing minds we have the same people playing tennis with their arguments. neither side is covered with glory. We have some people willing to discuss ideas, but most are stuck with the “no Im not, what are you” debate style. The ML with changes or the PL with changes could be agreed on by the more open minded of us. I support the ml form you proposed earlier

I have seen plenty of willingness to cooperate form the side that wants looting options back.
The op started the thread with the change to 100% vote to initiate ml rather than group lead just setting it
Pretty much everyone says 100% guild only which is more than it was in legion (when there were hardly any issues. All the horror stories are pre legion basically)
I have seen people saying mythic only
I have seen people saying ce only
I have seen people saying hall of fame only
I have seen people saying plnr
I have seen people saying what if we could pre choose a couple of pieces and if they drop they are tradeable and the rest is as it is now.

There is plenty of willingness to move from the old school ml and in fact I don’t think anyone is even asking for old school ml.

The PL only crown just says no.
One side is holding out an olive branch while the other tries to light it on fire.

Imo this isn’t a “both sides have mud on them” type situation.

[Avelpally-frostmourne]

@Spirits-icecrown

@Bynxy-stormrage

You quite literally can not prove that statement.

ML existed, had many complaints, Blizzard removed

So people didn’t want flying at the end of MoP? Since there was flying then in WoD there wasn’t…

@Chaosknite-frostmourne

I think i’ve figured out why these guys want ML back

What is there to figure out? We have told you dozens of times.

You can choose not to believe us if you want but that’s a you problem and we can’t make you. Everyone who does higher level raiding knows what we mean though. This is why atleast a bit of knowledge on a topic is important for people when they are taking about something

[Avelpally-frostmourne]

@Maidenofbeer-proudmoore

• changes to ML during the fight. people are busy fighting and miss the change. RL profits.
• RL sees the drop he was wanting, ignores previously agreed rules and takes it for himself.
• RL just flat takes everything and kicks anyone he wants to

Are you aware than raiding required a group of people to be able to kill bosses?
Raid leave and raid leader gets a bad reputation.
No one raids with them again.
They get no loot for the rest of the characters existence.

There was a guild on my realm (that I won’t mention by name for forum reasons) that was streaming mythic nyalotha sales and the GM said “don’t loot the boss so we don’t have to trade” and the guild was 100% dissolved within 48 hours. Also he got doxed (which I think shouldn’t have happened) and his business got review bombed and had to close as well.

I bet that raid leader wishes they had just done it properly and they could still have a guild.

@Bloodypaws-frostmourne

So we reward the group or persons who hold the loot ransom?

Would you describe the above guild as “being rewarded” since they got to keep the slappers from raaden?

[Murdercarpet-zuljin]

It doesn’t sound to me like something people would do, but if the people you know would go full-hearted into an exploit like that, better not even let them use pugs.

[Chaosknite-frostmourne]

Another rage fit by the thick headed dwarf.

@Chaosknite-frostmourne

I think i’ve figured out why these guys want ML back humor me on this one.

It was just a thought and not really something serious ah but u cant distinguish between that because of your thick skull.

[Cäpslöck-proudmoore]

Fun fact: personal loot being forced to be used made raid sales even more profitable.

[Chaosknite-frostmourne]

Im sure thats why the boosting communities were booming and swimming in gold.

And probably one of the reason more people will continue to buy boosts as a result.

I respect Individuals and guilds boosting and their hustle. I dont feel the same about boosting communities.

[Cäpslöck-proudmoore]

It took the profitability of selling heroic from a 10 to a 12.

those funnels are big sellers and can easily triple the price someone is paying.

Also enabled more buyers per run over a ML approach.

[Avelpally-frostmourne]

@Chaosknite-frostmourne

Another rage fit by the thick headed dwarf.

@Chaosknite-frostmourne

I think i’ve figured out why these guys want ML back humor me on this one.

It was just a thought and not really something serious ah but u cant distinguish between that because of your thick skull

No need to be impolite.

[Palaendra-thrall]

No matter how many times I see it, I never read the title of this thread correctly.

[Kalaen-black-dragonflight (Kalaen)]

They are carries. It eats at them. They are angsty. And just like there’s no metric of accomplishment to obtain leggos, or tier, or any gear via PL, there is no metric to whether or not they can spew their self-projection in forums, either.

[Azreluna-mannoroth (Azreluna)]

Nah, the difference is, with master loot, players can look at the loot history and say “hey, this person’s gotten the short end of the stick. Let’s fix that.”

[Hefthate-proudmoore]

@Lustrois-norgannon

And the sad thing is, PLNR can work just like ML with one caveat: The gear initially goes to a player first.

Who then trades it to the raidlead to distribute or gets lobbed from the guild.

How is this better? It just makes people feel like they are being robbed of their loot by having it go into their inventory first and reinforces the flawed idea that the item is theirs.

It would inevitably lead to more drama than ML with raiders in casual guilds who don’t understand the concept of earning things as a team arguing with their raidleads and getting kicked.

Just bring back ML and let guilds turn it on if they want to. Plenty of guilds would still use PL if ML existed. Not everyone needs to play the game the same way. If you prefer PL, just find a PL guild.