because i think we have the perfect amount in mythic raids and mythic +
mythic + is a fantastic endgame and if it isn’t broke i don’t think it needs fixing.
improvements could be made (key deleting) but im not convinced we need another option here.
i would rather time be spent making the dungeons more enjoyable across all weeks.
I dunno. I didn’t find Vanilla’s 55+ dungeons, which were quite difficult to anybody geared below full T1, to be that stressful, nor did I find TBC heroics that stressful despite playing most of those as a tank in an era where threat output was quite low. None of the difficult 5man content in WoW to date gave me anxiety like M+ keys can.
I never believe in perfect. There are always improvements that can be made. And having a different type of run for completion is an option. I don’t think it should be a cake walk. It should stress the group, just in a different way. I don’t get the resistance to even consider if there is something in this area that can be improved.
I think what it really comes down to for me is that the game has changed too much for my liking. It’s not necessarily bad. The game is actually quite playable. It’s just not the experience I remember.
Right now, I could hop on my main and do some content. I wouldn’t be doing it because it was fun though. I’d be doing it because of the chance for better gear. That, to me, is a signal that I am not the target audience for this type of game anymore.
Back in the day I felt like I was in a world. Now I feel like they built the instances and adjust the world around it. For that reason, I don’t feel like I’m part of an MMORPG, but a gameshow contestant. Some people probably love that, but I hate it. ![:expressionless:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/expressionless.png?v=6" ":expressionless:")
55 Vanillas are a different animal. It’s in the past and it is doubtful it will return except occasionally for special 1 offs like Legion’s iteration on Karazhan. And even then it made its way into the M+ rotation. The idea is that you never purely outgear the content unless you are running it at a level below your ability to complete it.
because it wouldn’t be developed in a vacuum
time spent creating an entire new difficulty that is difficult for different reasons takes time away from making the rest of the dungeons not unbearable.
i want to see a world where i don’t sit on my shrine key for a week and that world will never come if we saw a 4th difficulty type for 5 mans.
It’s a massive shame too, because by far the most fun I’ve had in this game was running those dungeons with my guildies. Nothing available now compares, it’s all too boxed in and “serious”.
I feel like you have such disdain for people with different perspectives on game play that you go out of your way to ignore what they’re actually saying, and to make up reasons for why (you think) they’re saying it.
I get you. I don’t understand why people think Blizzard is incapable of screwing up multiple things at once. Why limit them to screwing up just 1 thing at a time? Jokes aside, they could work on multiple projects for the game if they wanted to. And I agree that changing keys so they can’t be deleted was a bad decision. And we all know that all it takes is a hotfix, which they did to allow you to delete the keys in the first place. But I am never a fan of limiting the options of players. Right now, M+ only gives you a single option to progress. I wouldn’t mind there being another way to do it.
ya got me
10 chars
It’s a result of the MASSIVE leap in gear levels in a single expansion now. Remember, in Vanilla you were running around in greens and blues completing those dungeons.
Agree with OP
I loved the Vanilla 5 mans and the BC heroics. They required coordination and communication.
You mean, like normal-mythic dungeons a short time into this expac? ![:slight_smile:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/slight_smile.png?v=6" ":slight_smile:")
Is there some reason why the system can’t return to similar levels of deflation? Why is it necessary for ilvls to soar to stratospheric levels within a single patch and bounce off the moon by the end of the xpac?
Blizzard’s philosophy, mentioned in at least 1 Q&A, about needing the players to feel about 15% stronger in every raid tier release. This was not a thing in Vanilla.
TBH, it started in BC.
At the start of BC people were doing 500 DPS. By the end of T4 they were hitting close to 1000. By the end of T6 it wasn’t uncommon to see close to 2K DPS.
The dungeons before challenge modes and M+ were rather easy in comparison. TBC heroics were quite hard until you got tier 4 gear and then they were kind of faceroll. Yeah, I feel that people who don’t like GO GO GO deserve another dungeon progression path which would just be the same dungeons but without the timer aka much, much easier. It’s the same thing as suggesting that there should be a non rated pvp progression that gives the same rewards. No, you don’t deserve that either. It isn’t about ‘deserving’ either.
People who want SLOW SLOW SLOW already have easy dungeons they can do.
AMEN BROTHER! PREACH!!
I remember way back when I started, I only played solo with my Hunter. I tried a dungeon and didn’t use traps. Someone patient (NOT a gogo player) asked my why I even play a hunter with out using it’s unique kit tool. That opened my eyes up to it.
I spent the next day or two drawing multiple creatures so I could practice trapping. When I next ran a dungeon (In BC) I could chain trap 4 times. It was fun. It was a utility instead of just hack n slash.
I think Blizz has forgotten that this used to be a “Role Playing Game”. That Roles were not so simplistic as tank, heal, damage. Now everything is just a speed run by Go Go Dancers! Strategy is so Last decade!! GO GO GO! Hurry up and roll for random garbage dude!! or a few grains of azerite!
LOVE THIS POST!
I think what a lot of people want is something they can’t have. That feeling of exploration and discovery. They want to share in that enjoyment, and it’s just not something they can get outside of maybe week 1 of a new expansion.
Dungeons in BFA require more effort and coordination than Vanilla/BC dungeons if done at the intended item level. If you do Mythic dungeons in BFA at 285-290 item level, which is what they are designed around, you’ll see that you need to cc, interrupt and do mechanics. People fail super hard in BFA dungeons but it doesn’t matter because they outgear them by 50 item levels.
Imagine running BC heroics in full Heroic 25 man ICC gear, that’s basically what running BFA Mythic 0’s at 340-345 ilvl is.